±Recent Visitors

Recent Visitors to Com-Central!

±User Info-big


Welcome Anonymous

Nickname
Password

Membership:
Latest: cgsimpson
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Overall: 6645

People Online:
Members: 0
Visitors: 738
Total: 738
Who Is Where:
 Visitors:
01: Community Forums
02: Community Forums
03: Community Forums
04: Community Forums
05: Community Forums
06: Community Forums
07: Community Forums
08: Downloads
09: Community Forums
10: Community Forums
11: Community Forums
12: Community Forums
13: Home
14: Home
15: Home
16: Community Forums
17: Photo Gallery
18: Home
19: Community Forums
20: Community Forums
21: Community Forums
22: Community Forums
23: Photo Gallery
24: Statistics
25: Community Forums
26: Photo Gallery
27: Your Account
28: Community Forums
29: Photo Gallery
30: Home
31: Statistics
32: Home
33: Photo Gallery
34: Community Forums
35: Community Forums
36: Photo Gallery
37: Home
38: Your Account
39: Community Forums
40: Community Forums
41: Downloads
42: Community Forums
43: Home
44: Your Account
45: Your Account
46: Community Forums
47: Home
48: Home
49: Community Forums
50: Community Forums
51: Community Forums
52: Community Forums
53: Photo Gallery
54: Community Forums
55: Home
56: Community Forums
57: Community Forums
58: Community Forums
59: Community Forums
60: Photo Gallery
61: Community Forums
62: Home
63: Home
64: Community Forums
65: Community Forums
66: News Archive
67: Home
68: Community Forums
69: Community Forums
70: Community Forums
71: Home
72: Photo Gallery
73: Photo Gallery
74: Community Forums
75: Community Forums
76: Home
77: Community Forums
78: Home
79: Community Forums
80: Community Forums
81: Community Forums
82: Photo Gallery
83: Home
84: Community Forums
85: Community Forums
86: Photo Gallery
87: Member Screenshots
88: Community Forums
89: Photo Gallery
90: Home
91: Community Forums
92: Community Forums
93: Your Account
94: Home
95: Community Forums
96: Community Forums
97: Home
98: Member Screenshots
99: Community Forums
100: Community Forums
101: Community Forums
102: Statistics
103: Home
104: Community Forums
105: News Archive
106: Photo Gallery
107: Community Forums
108: Community Forums
109: Photo Gallery
110: Community Forums
111: Member Screenshots
112: Community Forums
113: Home
114: Community Forums
115: Home
116: Community Forums
117: Photo Gallery
118: Community Forums
119: Community Forums
120: Your Account
121: Community Forums
122: Community Forums
123: Community Forums
124: Home
125: Community Forums
126: Community Forums
127: Community Forums
128: Community Forums
129: Community Forums
130: Community Forums
131: Statistics
132: Community Forums
133: Community Forums
134: Home
135: Home
136: Your Account
137: Community Forums
138: Home
139: Community Forums
140: Photo Gallery
141: Photo Gallery
142: Community Forums
143: Photo Gallery
144: Community Forums
145: Community Forums
146: Community Forums
147: Community Forums
148: Community Forums
149: Community Forums
150: Community Forums
151: Community Forums
152: Photo Gallery
153: Photo Gallery
154: Home
155: Community Forums
156: Community Forums
157: Community Forums
158: Community Forums
159: Community Forums
160: Home
161: Community Forums
162: Home
163: Community Forums
164: Member Screenshots
165: Community Forums
166: Community Forums
167: Community Forums
168: Community Forums
169: Home
170: Community Forums
171: Home
172: Community Forums
173: Photo Gallery
174: Photo Gallery
175: Photo Gallery
176: Downloads
177: Member Screenshots
178: Community Forums
179: Community Forums
180: Photo Gallery
181: Community Forums
182: Photo Gallery
183: Community Forums
184: Member Screenshots
185: Photo Gallery
186: Community Forums
187: Community Forums
188: Photo Gallery
189: Community Forums
190: Home
191: Photo Gallery
192: Community Forums
193: Community Forums
194: Community Forums
195: Community Forums
196: Community Forums
197: Community Forums
198: Community Forums
199: Community Forums
200: Search
201: Community Forums
202: Community Forums
203: Community Forums
204: Community Forums
205: Community Forums
206: Community Forums
207: Community Forums
208: Community Forums
209: Community Forums
210: Community Forums
211: Community Forums
212: Community Forums
213: Community Forums
214: Community Forums
215: Community Forums
216: Your Account
217: Community Forums
218: Community Forums
219: Photo Gallery
220: Community Forums
221: Community Forums
222: Community Forums
223: Community Forums
224: Photo Gallery
225: Community Forums
226: Community Forums
227: Community Forums
228: Home
229: Photo Gallery
230: Community Forums
231: Community Forums
232: Photo Gallery
233: Community Forums
234: Community Forums
235: Community Forums
236: Community Forums
237: Home
238: Community Forums
239: Community Forums
240: Community Forums
241: Your Account
242: Community Forums
243: Your Account
244: Member Screenshots
245: Community Forums
246: Community Forums
247: Photo Gallery
248: Community Forums
249: Community Forums
250: Home
251: News Archive
252: Community Forums
253: Downloads
254: Community Forums
255: Home
256: Photo Gallery
257: Photo Gallery
258: Community Forums
259: Home
260: Home
261: Community Forums
262: Photo Gallery
263: Community Forums
264: Community Forums
265: Community Forums
266: Community Forums
267: Community Forums
268: Community Forums
269: Community Forums
270: Photo Gallery
271: Community Forums
272: Community Forums
273: Photo Gallery
274: Community Forums
275: Community Forums
276: Home
277: Home
278: Downloads
279: Your Account
280: Community Forums
281: Downloads
282: Statistics
283: Community Forums
284: Community Forums
285: Community Forums
286: Community Forums
287: Community Forums
288: Community Forums
289: Photo Gallery
290: Community Forums
291: Home
292: Community Forums
293: Community Forums
294: Community Forums
295: Statistics
296: Community Forums
297: Community Forums
298: Community Forums
299: Community Forums
300: Photo Gallery
301: Community Forums
302: Community Forums
303: Home
304: Community Forums
305: Community Forums
306: Community Forums
307: Community Forums
308: Member Screenshots
309: Community Forums
310: Home
311: Community Forums
312: Community Forums
313: CPGlang
314: Community Forums
315: Community Forums
316: Downloads
317: Community Forums
318: Community Forums
319: Community Forums
320: Community Forums
321: Photo Gallery
322: Community Forums
323: Photo Gallery
324: Community Forums
325: Community Forums
326: Home
327: Community Forums
328: Community Forums
329: Photo Gallery
330: Community Forums
331: Community Forums
332: Photo Gallery
333: Photo Gallery
334: Community Forums
335: Community Forums
336: Community Forums
337: Community Forums
338: Community Forums
339: Community Forums
340: Home
341: Statistics
342: Community Forums
343: Downloads
344: Community Forums
345: Community Forums
346: Photo Gallery
347: Photo Gallery
348: Community Forums
349: Community Forums
350: Community Forums
351: News
352: Photo Gallery
353: Member Screenshots
354: Photo Gallery
355: Community Forums
356: Home
357: Photo Gallery
358: Community Forums
359: Community Forums
360: Community Forums
361: Community Forums
362: Community Forums
363: Community Forums
364: Community Forums
365: Community Forums
366: Home
367: Community Forums
368: Community Forums
369: Community Forums
370: Home
371: Community Forums
372: Photo Gallery
373: Home
374: Photo Gallery
375: Photo Gallery
376: Community Forums
377: Photo Gallery
378: Community Forums
379: Community Forums
380: Community Forums
381: Community Forums
382: Community Forums
383: Photo Gallery
384: Community Forums
385: Community Forums
386: CPGlang
387: Photo Gallery
388: Community Forums
389: Community Forums
390: Community Forums
391: Community Forums
392: Photo Gallery
393: Photo Gallery
394: Photo Gallery
395: Tell a Friend
396: Photo Gallery
397: Home
398: Community Forums
399: Community Forums
400: Community Forums
401: Photo Gallery
402: Member Screenshots
403: Downloads
404: Home
405: Downloads
406: Photo Gallery
407: Community Forums
408: Photo Gallery
409: Community Forums
410: Community Forums
411: Community Forums
412: Photo Gallery
413: Home
414: Community Forums
415: Community Forums
416: Home
417: Community Forums
418: Community Forums
419: News
420: Community Forums
421: Home
422: Photo Gallery
423: Community Forums
424: Community Forums
425: Community Forums
426: Community Forums
427: Home
428: Community Forums
429: Community Forums
430: Photo Gallery
431: Community Forums
432: Community Forums
433: CPGlang
434: Community Forums
435: Your Account
436: Community Forums
437: News Archive
438: Photo Gallery
439: Community Forums
440: Community Forums
441: Photo Gallery
442: Community Forums
443: Community Forums
444: Home
445: Home
446: Downloads
447: Photo Gallery
448: Community Forums
449: Community Forums
450: Home
451: Downloads
452: Community Forums
453: Community Forums
454: Photo Gallery
455: Community Forums
456: Community Forums
457: Community Forums
458: Community Forums
459: Community Forums
460: Community Forums
461: Home
462: Home
463: Community Forums
464: Community Forums
465: Community Forums
466: Community Forums
467: Home
468: Community Forums
469: Downloads
470: Community Forums
471: Home
472: Community Forums
473: Community Forums
474: Community Forums
475: Photo Gallery
476: Community Forums
477: Community Forums
478: Community Forums
479: Community Forums
480: Statistics
481: Community Forums
482: Photo Gallery
483: Community Forums
484: Community Forums
485: Community Forums
486: Photo Gallery
487: Home
488: Community Forums
489: Community Forums
490: Community Forums
491: Home
492: Your Account
493: Community Forums
494: Community Forums
495: Community Forums
496: Community Forums
497: Home
498: Community Forums
499: Photo Gallery
500: Home
501: Community Forums
502: Home
503: Member Screenshots
504: Home
505: Community Forums
506: Home
507: Community Forums
508: Community Forums
509: Community Forums
510: Community Forums
511: Downloads
512: Community Forums
513: Community Forums
514: Community Forums
515: Community Forums
516: Home
517: Community Forums
518: Photo Gallery
519: Community Forums
520: Community Forums
521: News
522: Community Forums
523: Community Forums
524: Community Forums
525: Statistics
526: Photo Gallery
527: Community Forums
528: Community Forums
529: Community Forums
530: Community Forums
531: Community Forums
532: Community Forums
533: Home
534: Member Screenshots
535: Home
536: Community Forums
537: Photo Gallery
538: Community Forums
539: Photo Gallery
540: Community Forums
541: Community Forums
542: Home
543: Community Forums
544: Photo Gallery
545: Downloads
546: Home
547: Community Forums
548: Community Forums
549: Community Forums
550: Community Forums
551: Community Forums
552: Community Forums
553: Home
554: Community Forums
555: Home
556: Your Account
557: Photo Gallery
558: Community Forums
559: Community Forums
560: Community Forums
561: Community Forums
562: Photo Gallery
563: Community Forums
564: Community Forums
565: Home
566: Community Forums
567: Home
568: Community Forums
569: Community Forums
570: Community Forums
571: Community Forums
572: Community Forums
573: Home
574: Community Forums
575: Community Forums
576: Statistics
577: Photo Gallery
578: Community Forums
579: Community Forums
580: Photo Gallery
581: Community Forums
582: Community Forums
583: Community Forums
584: Downloads
585: Photo Gallery
586: Home
587: Community Forums
588: Community Forums
589: Community Forums
590: Community Forums
591: Home
592: Community Forums
593: Community Forums
594: Community Forums
595: Community Forums
596: Home
597: Community Forums
598: Community Forums
599: Home
600: Community Forums
601: Community Forums
602: Community Forums
603: Home
604: Community Forums
605: Community Forums
606: Member Screenshots
607: Photo Gallery
608: Home
609: Community Forums
610: Downloads
611: Member Screenshots
612: Photo Gallery
613: Photo Gallery
614: Member Screenshots
615: Your Account
616: Photo Gallery
617: Community Forums
618: Community Forums
619: Community Forums
620: Community Forums
621: Community Forums
622: Home
623: Community Forums
624: Community Forums
625: Community Forums
626: Community Forums
627: Home
628: Home
629: Community Forums
630: Community Forums
631: Community Forums
632: Community Forums
633: Photo Gallery
634: Community Forums
635: Community Forums
636: Home
637: Home
638: Community Forums
639: Community Forums
640: Community Forums
641: Community Forums
642: Community Forums
643: Community Forums
644: CPGlang
645: Home
646: Community Forums
647: Photo Gallery
648: Tell a Friend
649: Home
650: Community Forums
651: Community Forums
652: Community Forums
653: Photo Gallery
654: Community Forums
655: Photo Gallery
656: Community Forums
657: Downloads
658: Downloads
659: Photo Gallery
660: Photo Gallery
661: Community Forums
662: Community Forums
663: Community Forums
664: Community Forums
665: Photo Gallery
666: Home
667: Community Forums
668: Community Forums
669: Photo Gallery
670: Photo Gallery
671: Community Forums
672: Community Forums
673: Member Screenshots
674: Photo Gallery
675: Community Forums
676: Community Forums
677: Community Forums
678: Community Forums
679: Downloads
680: Community Forums
681: Community Forums
682: Community Forums
683: Community Forums
684: Community Forums
685: Photo Gallery
686: Photo Gallery
687: News Archive
688: Community Forums
689: Community Forums
690: Community Forums
691: Home
692: Community Forums
693: Downloads
694: Photo Gallery
695: Photo Gallery
696: Downloads
697: Photo Gallery
698: Community Forums
699: Community Forums
700: Photo Gallery
701: Photo Gallery
702: Community Forums
703: Community Forums
704: Community Forums
705: Community Forums
706: Community Forums
707: Community Forums
708: Community Forums
709: Photo Gallery
710: Home
711: Community Forums
712: Community Forums
713: Home
714: Community Forums
715: Downloads
716: Community Forums
717: Community Forums
718: Community Forums
719: Community Forums
720: Community Forums
721: Home
722: Community Forums
723: Home
724: Community Forums
725: Photo Gallery
726: Downloads
727: Your Account
728: Community Forums
729: Community Forums
730: Home
731: Community Forums
732: Home
733: Community Forums
734: Community Forums
735: Community Forums
736: Photo Gallery
737: Community Forums
738: Community Forums

Staff Online:

No staff members are online!
17 pdr HE Shells
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page     Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board

View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
J.McGillivray
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 149

PostPosted: Fri Oct 20, 2006 10:48 pm
Post subject: 17 pdr HE Shells

I thought that you may be interested to see a photo of 17pdr HE shells being loaded into a Canadian Firefly. The photo is NAC PA-113696 and the original caption reads:

“Sherman' tanks of the 4th Canadian Armoured Division shelling German position near the Dortmund-Ems Canal, Germany, 8 April 1945.�



Note the tracks used as extra armour.
Back to top
View user's profile
mike_Duplessis
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 236

PostPosted: Wed Nov 01, 2006 5:01 pm
Post subject: Re: 17 pdr HE Shells

I hear the 17 pdr had the same complaint as the Panther, namely a notably lackluster HE shell. I suppose higher tube pressures meant thicker-walled shell bodies, which meant smaller HE filling. That was the one saving grace of the Sherman 75 and T34 76.2 guns. The shells had a bit of an oblique 'artillery' heritage. Thier AT was lackluster but at least their HE had plenty 'o bang.
Back to top
View user's profile
bsmart
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 2523
Location: Central Maryland
PostPosted: Wed Nov 01, 2006 7:07 pm
Post subject: Re: 17 pdr HE Shells

Someone posted the numbers back on the old board

As I remember it from best to worst it was

90mm (M36 & M26)
75mm (Sherman)

76.2 & 3" (Sherman, M10)



17pdr (Firefly)

The gaps represent my memory of the scale of difference. I'll have to see if I saved that data somewhere

It may be a bias but I have noticed that british HE shells seem to have smaller fillers than comparable American, French and German shells. I'm working from spotty sources and poor memory but that is the impression I've always had

_________________
Bob Smart (bsmart@xecu.net)
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
J.McGillivray
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 149

PostPosted: Wed Nov 01, 2006 11:06 pm
Post subject: Re: 17 pdr HE Shells

It is my understanding that there was more than one type of 17pdr HE shell. I downloaded the page below from another web site, however I don’t remember where.



One had a higher explosive content the other, however, because it used a lower propellant charge the cartridge case would not eject and had to be manually extracted, thus reducing the rate of fire.
Back to top
View user's profile
J.McGillivray
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 149

PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2007 1:15 pm
Post subject: Re: 17 pdr HE Shells

It looks like the picture with the 17pdr HE shell is even more complicated. So far I’ve have found the following types of shells:

Shell HE Mk 1/T
Shell HE/T/HC
Shell HE/Super/HC Reduced Charge
Shell HE reduced charge with Tracer & Time Fuze.

But basically it comes down to there being two main types of 17pdr HE Shells.

The first weighted 16.9lbs and had about the same MV and trajectory as the AP shot. This was so the gunner could use the same range settings on his sights for both types of rounds. These came into use in 1943. It is claimed that these shells are inferior to the 75mm HE Shell of the Sherman because of their poor fragmentation pattern. However, it should be noted that these 17pdr Shells were intended for use against fortifications, i.e. concrete busting, and not as an anti-personnel weapon.

The second type weight 15.4lbs. It is the same HE shell as used with the British 3in 20cwt AA Gun, but fitted to the 17pdr cartridge with a reduced propellant charge. These shells were used in the indirect fire role and could be fitted with a time fuze (from the AA gun) for air bursts. (Note that for the 77mm gun on the Comet the 17pdr AP ammo was fitted to the cartridge case from the 3in 20cwt AA gun.) Below are photos of some firefly tanks being used as field artillery:









Back to top
View user's profile
Doug_Kibbey
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 4678
Location: The Great Satan
PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2007 1:34 pm
Post subject: Re: 17 pdr HE Shells

Also from Hunnicutt, "Sherman"
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
J.McGillivray
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 149

PostPosted: Tue Sep 04, 2007 9:10 pm
Post subject: Re: 17 pdr HE Shells

Here are some photos I took showing the sight mounts for the 17pdr A/T gun. Note that it has mounts foe both a telescopic for direct fire and a panoramic dial sight for indirect fire. The bottom two photos show the range scales. You can see that there are scales for three types as ammunition as follows:

APCBC FULL
2900 F.S.

AP SV/DS
3950 F.S.

HE/Mk 2 T
FUZE No 244 1800 F.S.









Back to top
View user's profile
J.McGillivray
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 149

PostPosted: Sat Sep 08, 2007 12:09 pm
Post subject: Re: 17 pdr HE Shells

There is a lot of information concerning the 17pdr gun along with its ammunition on David Boyd’s site.

www.wwiiequipment.com/...under.aspx
Back to top
View user's profile
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page    Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board
Page 1 of 1
All times are GMT - 6 Hours



Jump to:  


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum