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panther found in basement?
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
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Walter_Sobchak
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2015 11:14 pm
Post subject: panther found in basement?

This article appeared in a German news source. I have read it using a translator program, but if anyone here reads German, it would be nice to have a better version. From what I can gather from the translation, they found a WW2 Panther in some guys basement near the Baltic Sea?!?

https://translate.google.de/translate?hl=en&sl=de&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.spiegel.de%2Fpanorama%2Fjustiz%2Fpanzer-in-keller-polizei-durchsucht-villa-in-heikendorf-a-1041633.html
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Rikard_Hufschmied
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2015 9:45 am
Post subject: Re: panther found in basement?

Until I see it I reserve the right to a degree of skepticism. If a Panther it's sensational but I will not be surprised if "only" a Pz IV ... or III.

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Rikard_Hufschmied
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2015 11:42 am
Post subject: Re: panther found in basement?

Unless ... this is the collection of Herr Flick?

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Rikard_Hufschmied
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2015 11:50 am
Post subject: Re: panther found in basement?

As there is a company with the name Flick Finanz in Heikendorf we are probably looking at the confiscation of Friedrich Christian Flicks extensive WW2 weapons collection ... and then it really is a Panther. Flick's Panther has been rumored for years to have been kept "in a basement" and from one of the few pictures that exists it sure looks that way, though the basement is more of an underground garage.


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vmmv1
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2015 2:19 pm
Post subject: Re: panther found in basement?

His Panther does exist, in an underground garage. Would be nice to see it land up in a museum on display.
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Rikard_Hufschmied
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2015 4:41 pm
Post subject: Re: panther found in basement?

The question is why and why now? I've heard rumors over the years but that's all there's been to it, rumors.

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Pzkpfw-e
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2015 4:51 pm
Post subject: Re: panther found in basement?

[img]https://scontent-fra3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xtp1/v/t1.0-9/11209534_375847339292162_3936257324987463296_n.jpg?oh=af00dd3b45748ecbd9f18f70daf63de1&oe=5630B1DD[/img]

His basement contents is quite well known.
I wonder if he's pissed somebody off & they've made an official complaint. Has it had the demilling that German law requires?
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the_shadock
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2015 7:07 pm
Post subject: Re: panther found in basement?

A link provided by Patrik :
http://www.ndr.de/nachrichten/schleswig-holstein/Erfolgreich-Kampfpanzer-aus-Villa-geborgen,munitionsfund124.html


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Asbjoern
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2015 9:20 pm
Post subject: Re: panther found in basement?

- Pzkpfw-e

I wonder if he's pissed somebody off & they've made an official complaint. Has it had the demilling that German law requires?


Thats what I think too ... he should have been involved in some dealings with Nazi art solen several years ago and I think they were not able to take him to court for that so they looked for something else... and a big collection of military stuff is always good for some legal errors... a cutout in the armor 1 cm to narrow or a hole 1 cm to small in the gun ... or what ever...

Jens
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TrevorLarkum
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2015 11:21 pm
Post subject: Re: panther found in basement?

That Panther was originally recovered from a few miles away from my parents' house, though I didn't hear about it until after it had gone.

UID 48: Panther, Flick Collection

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Michel_Krauss
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 03, 2015 5:22 pm
Post subject: Re: panther found in basement?

- Asbjoern
- Pzkpfw-e

I wonder if he's pissed somebody off & they've made an official complaint. Has it had the demilling that German law requires?


Thats what I think too ... he should have been involved in some dealings with Nazi art solen several years ago and I think they were not able to take him to court for that so they looked for something else... and a big collection of military stuff is always good for some legal errors... a cutout in the armor 1 cm to narrow or a hole 1 cm to small in the gun ... or what ever...

Jens


recently they discovered a big nazi art collection of items that where either assum to be lost during the war or that disappeared after the war

And this collection belonged, amongst other, to Flick

The military stuf is just a side show, however more spectacular
A tank has written military (= very dangerous) all over it, where a big Nazi sculpture of a horse .... is just a big sculpture

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the_shadock
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 03, 2015 6:51 pm
Post subject: Re: panther found in basement?

just praise for the Panther not to be scrapped or cut in pieces..

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Costas_TT
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 03, 2015 8:39 pm
Post subject: Re: panther found in basement?

Agreed. Ending up as a range target is a much more honorable end for it. Razz

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Rikard_Hufschmied
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2015 2:22 am
Post subject: Re: panther found in basement?

I see we've got the ownership wrong though. It's been assumed that the Panther in question has been owned by one of two main heirs to the wealth of the Flick Industrial Empire, Friedrich Christian Flick but this is clearly not the case. The owner of the Panther is clearly written out as 78-year old Klaus Dieter Flick. Better start amending those registries!

As the second main heir to the Flick fortune, an older brother to Friedrich Christian, is named Gert Rudolf Flick it also rules out any direct family connection. The question remains though, is there any relation? A cousin maybe?

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Rikard_Hufschmied
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2015 2:39 am
Post subject: Re: panther found in basement?

It's also quite apparent that local authorities have been uncomfortable with Klaus Dieter Flick for quite some time and adopted the "better to be safe than sorry" stance and hence taken action accordingly.

This in combination with the "Nazi-Art" affair has clearly been a thumb in the eye for some, and the "closet Nazi" rumors have certainly made matters even worse.

You have to take in to consideration that Third Reich symbols in private hands are outright outlawed in the Federal Republic, even Waffenamt stampings are considered eagle-swastika and the swastika has to be permanently removed.

The second world war is a touchy subject in Germany, with good right if you ask me, so I will not be surprised if they go after Klaus Dieter with everything they've got.

We need not worry about the Panther being cut up, they know the value of it. If not returned, which I doubt, it will end up in a museum for sure.

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