±Recent Visitors

Recent Visitors to Com-Central!

±User Info-big


Welcome Anonymous

Nickname
Password

Membership:
Latest: HighestAce
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Overall: 6648

People Online:
Members: 0
Visitors: 454
Total: 454
Who Is Where:
 Visitors:
01: Community Forums
02: Community Forums
03: Community Forums
04: Home
05: Downloads
06: Community Forums
07: Community Forums
08: Community Forums
09: Home
10: Home
11: Community Forums
12: Community Forums
13: Community Forums
14: Community Forums
15: Community Forums
16: Community Forums
17: Community Forums
18: Community Forums
19: Home
20: Community Forums
21: Community Forums
22: Community Forums
23: Community Forums
24: Community Forums
25: Community Forums
26: Community Forums
27: Community Forums
28: Community Forums
29: Community Forums
30: Community Forums
31: Community Forums
32: Home
33: News Archive
34: Home
35: Downloads
36: Community Forums
37: Community Forums
38: Community Forums
39: Home
40: Community Forums
41: Community Forums
42: Community Forums
43: Community Forums
44: Photo Gallery
45: Community Forums
46: Your Account
47: Downloads
48: Community Forums
49: Community Forums
50: Community Forums
51: News Archive
52: Home
53: Home
54: Community Forums
55: Community Forums
56: Home
57: Home
58: Home
59: Home
60: Home
61: Community Forums
62: Home
63: Home
64: Home
65: Community Forums
66: Home
67: Downloads
68: Photo Gallery
69: Home
70: Photo Gallery
71: Downloads
72: Community Forums
73: Community Forums
74: Home
75: Community Forums
76: Community Forums
77: Community Forums
78: Home
79: Community Forums
80: News
81: Home
82: Home
83: Home
84: Home
85: Home
86: Home
87: Downloads
88: Community Forums
89: Home
90: Community Forums
91: Home
92: Home
93: Home
94: Downloads
95: Home
96: Community Forums
97: Home
98: Home
99: Home
100: Home
101: Home
102: Home
103: Community Forums
104: Home
105: Community Forums
106: Community Forums
107: Home
108: Community Forums
109: Home
110: Community Forums
111: Community Forums
112: Home
113: Your Account
114: Community Forums
115: Home
116: Community Forums
117: Community Forums
118: Home
119: Home
120: Community Forums
121: Community Forums
122: Home
123: Community Forums
124: Community Forums
125: Community Forums
126: Home
127: Home
128: Member Screenshots
129: Home
130: Home
131: Home
132: Home
133: Community Forums
134: Home
135: Community Forums
136: Home
137: Home
138: Member Screenshots
139: Photo Gallery
140: Home
141: Community Forums
142: Home
143: Home
144: Community Forums
145: Home
146: Home
147: Home
148: Photo Gallery
149: Home
150: Community Forums
151: Community Forums
152: Community Forums
153: Community Forums
154: Home
155: Home
156: Home
157: Community Forums
158: Home
159: Community Forums
160: Home
161: Home
162: Community Forums
163: Home
164: Photo Gallery
165: Community Forums
166: Home
167: Home
168: Home
169: Community Forums
170: Community Forums
171: Home
172: Community Forums
173: Community Forums
174: Home
175: Community Forums
176: Community Forums
177: Community Forums
178: Home
179: Community Forums
180: Home
181: Community Forums
182: Community Forums
183: Downloads
184: Community Forums
185: Home
186: Community Forums
187: Community Forums
188: Home
189: Home
190: Photo Gallery
191: Community Forums
192: Home
193: Home
194: Home
195: Community Forums
196: Home
197: Community Forums
198: News Archive
199: Home
200: Community Forums
201: Home
202: Community Forums
203: Home
204: Home
205: Downloads
206: Home
207: Community Forums
208: Community Forums
209: Community Forums
210: Community Forums
211: Community Forums
212: Community Forums
213: Home
214: Community Forums
215: Community Forums
216: Home
217: Community Forums
218: Home
219: Community Forums
220: Community Forums
221: Community Forums
222: Home
223: Home
224: Member Screenshots
225: Community Forums
226: Home
227: Community Forums
228: Community Forums
229: Community Forums
230: Community Forums
231: Community Forums
232: Community Forums
233: Community Forums
234: Home
235: Photo Gallery
236: Community Forums
237: Community Forums
238: Community Forums
239: Community Forums
240: Home
241: News Archive
242: Home
243: Home
244: Home
245: Home
246: Home
247: Community Forums
248: Home
249: Photo Gallery
250: Home
251: Community Forums
252: Community Forums
253: Member Screenshots
254: Home
255: Community Forums
256: Home
257: Home
258: Community Forums
259: Home
260: Community Forums
261: Home
262: Photo Gallery
263: Home
264: Downloads
265: News Archive
266: Community Forums
267: Downloads
268: Community Forums
269: Community Forums
270: Community Forums
271: Photo Gallery
272: Community Forums
273: Home
274: Community Forums
275: Community Forums
276: Home
277: Community Forums
278: News Archive
279: Community Forums
280: Community Forums
281: Community Forums
282: Community Forums
283: Community Forums
284: Home
285: Community Forums
286: Community Forums
287: Community Forums
288: Home
289: Community Forums
290: Community Forums
291: Community Forums
292: Community Forums
293: Community Forums
294: Your Account
295: Home
296: Community Forums
297: Home
298: Community Forums
299: Community Forums
300: Community Forums
301: Photo Gallery
302: Community Forums
303: Home
304: Community Forums
305: Community Forums
306: Community Forums
307: Community Forums
308: Community Forums
309: Community Forums
310: Community Forums
311: Community Forums
312: Community Forums
313: Community Forums
314: Community Forums
315: Community Forums
316: Community Forums
317: Community Forums
318: News
319: Community Forums
320: Community Forums
321: Community Forums
322: Community Forums
323: Community Forums
324: Community Forums
325: Home
326: Community Forums
327: Community Forums
328: Home
329: Community Forums
330: Community Forums
331: Community Forums
332: Community Forums
333: Home
334: Community Forums
335: Community Forums
336: Community Forums
337: Community Forums
338: Home
339: Community Forums
340: Community Forums
341: Community Forums
342: Member Screenshots
343: Community Forums
344: Community Forums
345: Your Account
346: Community Forums
347: Your Account
348: Photo Gallery
349: Community Forums
350: Community Forums
351: Your Account
352: Community Forums
353: Community Forums
354: Community Forums
355: Community Forums
356: Community Forums
357: Community Forums
358: Home
359: Home
360: Home
361: Home
362: Home
363: Home
364: Community Forums
365: Home
366: Home
367: Home
368: Home
369: Home
370: Home
371: Home
372: Home
373: Home
374: Home
375: Home
376: Home
377: Home
378: Home
379: Home
380: Home
381: Community Forums
382: Community Forums
383: Home
384: Home
385: Home
386: News Archive
387: Your Account
388: Home
389: Photo Gallery
390: Home
391: Home
392: Home
393: Home
394: Home
395: Home
396: Community Forums
397: Community Forums
398: Your Account
399: Home
400: Home
401: Home
402: Home
403: Home
404: Home
405: Home
406: Home
407: Home
408: Community Forums
409: Home
410: Home
411: Community Forums
412: Home
413: Home
414: Home
415: Community Forums
416: Home
417: Home
418: Home
419: Home
420: Home
421: Community Forums
422: Home
423: Community Forums
424: Home
425: Community Forums
426: Home
427: Community Forums
428: Community Forums
429: Community Forums
430: Home
431: Community Forums
432: Home
433: Community Forums
434: News Archive
435: Member Screenshots
436: Your Account
437: Community Forums
438: Community Forums
439: Downloads
440: Home
441: Home
442: Community Forums
443: Community Forums
444: Community Forums
445: Home
446: Home
447: Community Forums
448: Community Forums
449: Community Forums
450: Photo Gallery
451: News
452: Community Forums
453: Downloads
454: Community Forums

Staff Online:

No staff members are online!
New Pics from APG - M4A1(76) Sherman, M60A2, LT-35, S-35,
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
Go to page 1, 2  Next
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page     Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board

View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Neil_Baumgardner
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 3942
Location: Arlington, VA
PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2006 2:43 am
Post subject: New Pics from APG - M4A1(76) Sherman, M60A2, LT-35, S-35,

Got a decent number of good pics despite the weather on Saturday. Also had a good time being a member of Bob's tour.

First off, here's the recently arrived M4A1(76) Sherman. I know Jeff has been interested in this Sherman.





This Sherman has markings from three different units - French army, 14th ACR and 11th ACR.

The French markings could well be the oldest and possibly date to WWII. As typical with Free French Shermans, this one is named. Its very hard to make out, but it appears to match up with a Free French Sherman named "Niederbronn." There was a Sherman by that name in the 4e squadron of the 1er Cuirassiers. Unfortunately, I cant find any other info to confirm if that Sherman was indeed an M4A1(76). The French often re-painted Shermans after the war in the colors of a notable wartime Sherman, so this may or may not be an original. It could have well been a French army tank monument at one time...



The turret sides have the insignia of the 14th Armored Cavalry Regiment on them.





As you can also see, there are names underneath the 14th ACR insignia, but I cant quite make them out...



The Sherman also has 2/11 ACR on its fenders, I assume this was the last owners. Did the 11th ACR take over from the 14th in Germany?

Here's the Ordnance Museum's new M60A2 that just appeared.





The museum's Czech LT-35 has just come out of the refurb facility:





I am interested to see that the LT-35 has what appear to be bullet marks on the front hull - considering it was captured at the Hillersleiben proving ground (like many other items) in 1945. Maybe GIs shot at it to make sure it wasnt operational as the area was being seized?



The Somua S-35 also apparently about to go through the restoration facility, along with the Vickers Mk VIB light tank. The hatch to the S-35 was open, so I took the liberty of taking a few pics Wink

BTW, the S-35 was also captured at Hillerslieben.



Engine



Gun Breech & Turret interior



Ammo Rack



The Mk VIB was mostly wrapped up, but has been stripped in prep for repainting.



Thats enough for now. More to come though. The museum's Matilda also had a hatch open, so I got a few interior pics. Also took some better pics in the museum warehouse of the Christie tank, T1E2 Cunningham light tank, M1920 75mm GMC (just came through refurb), etc.

Neil


Last edited by Neil_Baumgardner on Mon Feb 06, 2006 3:13 am; edited 2 times in total
Back to top
View user's profile
Doug_Kibbey
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 4678
Location: The Great Satan
PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2006 2:59 am
Post subject: Re: New Pics from APG - M4A1(76) Sherman, M60A2, LT-35, S-35,

- Neil_Baumgardner

This Sherman has markings from three different units - French army, 14th ACR and 11th ACR.

The Sherman also has 2/11 ACR on its fenders, I assume this was the last owners. Did the 11th ACR take over from the 14th in Germany?

Neil


Neil,
Yes, the 14th reflagged as the 2/11th ACR not long after their stand-down from Vietnam (that would be not long after Roy and I left it)...the markings make perfect sense.

Any idea where the M60A2 came from? Any numbers? (any trace of "test operation" to be found on sponsons or front glacis?...or "TEC-EBD" on lower glacis as "bumper markings")

Doug


Last edited by Doug_Kibbey on Mon Feb 06, 2006 3:07 am; edited 3 times in total
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
SFC_Jeff_Button
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1311
Location: Ft Hood, TX
PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2006 3:02 am
Post subject: Re: New Pics from APG - M4A1(76) Sherman, M60A2, LT-35, S-35

Neil,
Damn straight I'm interested in that Sherman. I've done what I can though. I notified Neil Morrison, the museum director, (he's the man showing Doug the exhibits in the 11th ACR museum pictures I posted from Dougs visit here) and he's got the ball now. He told me he will have the post and 11th ACR commanders request the tank be sen to the NTC for display. That Shermans tread looks remarkably clean and free of rust. Was it replaced or refurbished somehow? I'll forward these pictures to Neil tomorrow.

_________________
SFC Jeff Button "High Angle Hell"
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Photo Gallery
Neil_Baumgardner
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 3942
Location: Arlington, VA
PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2006 3:08 am
Post subject: Re: New Pics from APG - M4A1(76) Sherman, M60A2, LT-35, S-35,

- Doug_Kibbey


Neil,
Yes, the 14th reflagged as the 2/11th ACR not long after their stand-down from Vietnam...the markings make perfect sense.


Thanks. Curious about the names though...


Any idea where the M60A2 came from? Any numbers? (any trace of "test operation" to be found on sponsons or front glacis?)

Doug


Actually, I think it came from "behind the fence." The front hull has "demil," "sold" and "museum" written on it, as well as "S/N 136785." "Identified for Turnin" is also painted on repeatedly.

"Auto [?]ost" appears to be written on the lower right and left hull, maybe with arrows pointing towards the idler?

Here's a front pic.



Neil
Back to top
View user's profile
Doug_Kibbey
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 4678
Location: The Great Satan
PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2006 3:12 am
Post subject: Re: New Pics from APG - M4A1(76) Sherman, M60A2, LT-35, S-35,

- Neil_Baumgardner
- Doug_Kibbey


Neil,
Yes, the 14th reflagged as the 2/11th ACR not long after their stand-down from Vietnam...the markings make perfect sense.


Thanks. Curious about the names though...

Neil


Neil...
That is a great question that should be posed to the guys at www.eaglehorse.org Try Bob Stephanowisc (sp?) who's listed...post in the guestbook and a link to your pic. Somebody might well recognize the names from an old roster or they may well have pics in their extensive gallery there (which you can view, they have useful labels in most cases)
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
Kurt_Laughlin
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 577

PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2006 3:43 am
Post subject: Re: New Pics from APG - M4A1(76) Sherman, M60A2, LT-35, S-35,

I think you'll find a number of names overlaying each other. Typically these gate guards are repainted with the names of the crew that won the annual or most recent gunnery competition or overall "tankmanship" type award.

KL
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Doug_Kibbey
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 4678
Location: The Great Satan
PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2006 3:58 am
Post subject: Re: New Pics from APG - M4A1(76) Sherman, M60A2, LT-35, S-35

Neil,
Those four mounting points on the front glacis are interesting...I wonder what's up with that? Never seen anything like that on these before.

Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
JimWeb
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1439
Location: The back of beyond
PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2006 8:25 am
Post subject: Re: New Pics from APG - M4A1(76) Sherman, M60A2, LT-35, S-35

- Doug_Kibbey
Neil,
Those four mounting points on the front glacis are interesting...I wonder what's up with that? Never seen anything like that on these before.


Ladder mounts which would make that vehicle an M60A1E1?

Cool

_________________
TTFN
Jim

If your not a member of JED then your
not serious about anything military..

***********************
www.jedsite.info
JED Military Equipment
***********************
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website ICQ Number
Chris_C
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 29, 2006
Posts: 214
Location: WV, USA
PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2006 8:39 am
Post subject: Re: New Pics from APG - M4A1(76) Sherman, M60A2, LT-35, S-35

I dunno...the ladders looked like they were mounted right up against the left-side headlight guard. These are more centered?

Edit: It's also based on an M60A1 hull, so that would make it an M60A1E2 if it were one of the prototypes. Wink
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Doug_Kibbey
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 4678
Location: The Great Satan
PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2006 8:58 am
Post subject: Re: New Pics from APG - M4A1(76) Sherman, M60A2, LT-35, S-35

- Chris_C
I dunno...the ladders looked like they were mounted right up against the left-side headlight guard. These are more centered?

Edit: It's also based on an M60A1 hull, so that would make it an M60A1E2 if it were one of the prototypes. Wink


Agreed...the only ladder mounts I've seen were offset to the loader's side...and in very few pics at that...always of an early development version.
I haven't seen a pic of one center-mounted...which is why I asked.
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
Neil_Baumgardner
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 3942
Location: Arlington, VA
PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2006 12:03 pm
Post subject: Re: New Pics from APG - M4A1(76) Sherman, M60A2, LT-35, S-35

- Doug_Kibbey
- Chris_C
I dunno...the ladders looked like they were mounted right up against the left-side headlight guard. These are more centered?

Edit: It's also based on an M60A1 hull, so that would make it an M60A1E2 if it were one of the prototypes. Wink


Agreed...the only ladder mounts I've seen were offset to the loader's side...and in very few pics at that...always of an early development version.
I haven't seen a pic of one center-mounted...which is why I asked.


Yeah, I looked at that too.

However, I'd note that the turret is an M60A2 model rather than a developmental model.

Neil
Back to top
View user's profile
Doug_Kibbey
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 4678
Location: The Great Satan
PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2006 2:15 pm
Post subject: Re: New Pics from APG - M4A1(76) Sherman, M60A2, LT-35, S-35

- Neil_Baumgardner
However, I'd note that the turret is an M60A2 model rather than a developmental model.

Neil


Yep, I'd already noticed and commented on that. This is either a full-on M60A2 or a vehicle cobbled together from gen-u-ine A2 bits (for what reason I really can't imagine). I've never seen any pic of an A2 that had a ladder mount on the glacis, or anything else for that matter. It looks too elaborate and heavy-duty to have been a plaque mount on a display tank.

Any kind of plows or blades ever been stuck on one of these?
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
Neil_Baumgardner
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 3942
Location: Arlington, VA
PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2006 3:07 pm
Post subject: Some more pics from APG - Matilda, M1920, Christie, T1E2, et

As promised, some interior pics of the museum's Matilda.







Of course the Ordnance Museum's Matilda has a fairly interesting history. It was lost to the Germans in a battle at Sidi Rezag-Halfaya Pass in November 1941. It was re-marked by the Germans and used as a pill box at the same pass until recaptured by the British after the battle of El Alemein in October 1942. It was then sent to the US as part of reverse Lend-Lease scrap shipments in 1943 and diverted by COL Jarrett to the museum in 1944.

Now some pics from inside the museum warehouse. Sorry Don, the Ontos is gone. I assume its back at Quantico now - the new National Museum of the US Marine Corps is set to open on November 10th.

The long-missing M1920 75mm gun motor carriage has re-appeared in the warehouse after having gone through the refurb facility:





Some more pics of the T3 Christie Tornado:



The Christie's engine:



The T1E2 Cunningham light tank



The M1922E Mk X 4.7" Gun Motor Carriage (bad lighting)



Neil
Back to top
View user's profile
Neil_Baumgardner
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 3942
Location: Arlington, VA
PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2006 3:12 pm
Post subject: Re: New Pics from APG - M4A1(76) Sherman, M60A2, LT-35, S-35,

BTW, the Christie's Liberty V-12 engine looks to be in relatively good condition (at least the front of it does). If there's one thing at the Ordnance Museum I'd like to see running it would probably be the Christie - if just because it could move! Supposedly up to 70mph on wheels?!

Neil
Back to top
View user's profile
bsmart
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 2523
Location: Central Maryland
PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2006 9:53 pm
Post subject: Re: New Pics from APG - M4A1(76) Sherman, M60A2, LT-35, S-35,

Folks, I want to sing Neils praises. I was there when he took the Matilda pics. I couldn't see as much detail by looking in the hatch as Neil has in the pictures! And those pictures were made with a handheld 'ctick the camera in the hatch' method. And the warehouse doesn't seem to be lit anywhere near as well as Neil makes it appear.

Neil Thanks for all the photo's I know I like them and I can see the subjects on a regular basis. For the folks who can't get to Aberdeen the pictures are the next best thing. Of course you don't get the inciteful commentary that you get on my guided tours Smile So there is still a reason to make the trip.

_________________
Bob Smart (bsmart@xecu.net)
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page    Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board
Page 1 of 2
All times are GMT - 6 Hours
Go to page 1, 2  Next



Jump to:  


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum