±Recent Visitors

Recent Visitors to Com-Central!

±User Info-big


Welcome Anonymous

Nickname
Password

Membership:
Latest: cgsimpson
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Overall: 6645

People Online:
Members: 0
Visitors: 578
Total: 578
Who Is Where:
 Visitors:
01: Community Forums
02: Home
03: Community Forums
04: Downloads
05: Downloads
06: Community Forums
07: Community Forums
08: Community Forums
09: Community Forums
10: Community Forums
11: Photo Gallery
12: Photo Gallery
13: Community Forums
14: Home
15: Community Forums
16: Community Forums
17: Home
18: Community Forums
19: Home
20: Community Forums
21: Community Forums
22: Community Forums
23: Community Forums
24: Downloads
25: Photo Gallery
26: Downloads
27: Photo Gallery
28: Community Forums
29: Home
30: Your Account
31: Community Forums
32: Your Account
33: Community Forums
34: Home
35: Community Forums
36: Community Forums
37: Community Forums
38: Community Forums
39: Community Forums
40: Community Forums
41: Community Forums
42: Your Account
43: Community Forums
44: Photo Gallery
45: Photo Gallery
46: Downloads
47: Home
48: Photo Gallery
49: Community Forums
50: Community Forums
51: Community Forums
52: Community Forums
53: Community Forums
54: Photo Gallery
55: Community Forums
56: Home
57: Community Forums
58: Photo Gallery
59: Community Forums
60: Home
61: Member Screenshots
62: Downloads
63: Photo Gallery
64: Home
65: CPGlang
66: Photo Gallery
67: Photo Gallery
68: Community Forums
69: Community Forums
70: Photo Gallery
71: Photo Gallery
72: Photo Gallery
73: Community Forums
74: Community Forums
75: Community Forums
76: Photo Gallery
77: Community Forums
78: Community Forums
79: Community Forums
80: Community Forums
81: Community Forums
82: Community Forums
83: Home
84: Community Forums
85: Community Forums
86: Photo Gallery
87: Community Forums
88: Community Forums
89: Community Forums
90: Community Forums
91: Community Forums
92: Community Forums
93: Community Forums
94: Community Forums
95: Community Forums
96: Community Forums
97: Community Forums
98: Member Screenshots
99: Statistics
100: Community Forums
101: Photo Gallery
102: Community Forums
103: Photo Gallery
104: Community Forums
105: Community Forums
106: Photo Gallery
107: Community Forums
108: Community Forums
109: Photo Gallery
110: Community Forums
111: Community Forums
112: Community Forums
113: Community Forums
114: Community Forums
115: Community Forums
116: Community Forums
117: Photo Gallery
118: Member Screenshots
119: Community Forums
120: Community Forums
121: Your Account
122: Home
123: Photo Gallery
124: Community Forums
125: Community Forums
126: Community Forums
127: Home
128: CPGlang
129: Your Account
130: Community Forums
131: Community Forums
132: Photo Gallery
133: Home
134: Community Forums
135: Community Forums
136: Community Forums
137: Community Forums
138: Community Forums
139: Home
140: Community Forums
141: Your Account
142: Photo Gallery
143: Member Screenshots
144: Community Forums
145: Home
146: Home
147: Community Forums
148: Community Forums
149: Community Forums
150: Statistics
151: Home
152: Community Forums
153: Your Account
154: Community Forums
155: Community Forums
156: Community Forums
157: Home
158: Home
159: Community Forums
160: Community Forums
161: Home
162: Community Forums
163: Photo Gallery
164: Community Forums
165: Community Forums
166: Community Forums
167: Home
168: Community Forums
169: Community Forums
170: Downloads
171: CPGlang
172: Community Forums
173: Community Forums
174: Community Forums
175: Home
176: Community Forums
177: Community Forums
178: Community Forums
179: Community Forums
180: Photo Gallery
181: Community Forums
182: CPGlang
183: Community Forums
184: Photo Gallery
185: Photo Gallery
186: Community Forums
187: Home
188: Photo Gallery
189: Community Forums
190: Photo Gallery
191: Community Forums
192: Community Forums
193: Photo Gallery
194: Home
195: Downloads
196: Community Forums
197: Photo Gallery
198: Community Forums
199: Home
200: Photo Gallery
201: Community Forums
202: Community Forums
203: Community Forums
204: Photo Gallery
205: Community Forums
206: Community Forums
207: Community Forums
208: Community Forums
209: Home
210: Downloads
211: Community Forums
212: Community Forums
213: Home
214: Downloads
215: Community Forums
216: Home
217: Member Screenshots
218: Community Forums
219: CPGlang
220: Community Forums
221: Community Forums
222: Community Forums
223: Community Forums
224: Photo Gallery
225: Community Forums
226: Your Account
227: Community Forums
228: Community Forums
229: Community Forums
230: Photo Gallery
231: Community Forums
232: Photo Gallery
233: Community Forums
234: Community Forums
235: Community Forums
236: Your Account
237: Community Forums
238: Community Forums
239: Community Forums
240: Community Forums
241: Community Forums
242: Home
243: Photo Gallery
244: News Archive
245: Community Forums
246: Home
247: Downloads
248: Statistics
249: Photo Gallery
250: Community Forums
251: Community Forums
252: Community Forums
253: Photo Gallery
254: Your Account
255: Photo Gallery
256: Home
257: Community Forums
258: Community Forums
259: Community Forums
260: Community Forums
261: Community Forums
262: Community Forums
263: Community Forums
264: Community Forums
265: Community Forums
266: Your Account
267: Community Forums
268: Photo Gallery
269: Photo Gallery
270: Community Forums
271: Community Forums
272: Home
273: Downloads
274: Community Forums
275: Community Forums
276: Community Forums
277: Community Forums
278: Community Forums
279: Community Forums
280: Community Forums
281: Community Forums
282: Community Forums
283: Community Forums
284: Community Forums
285: Community Forums
286: Community Forums
287: Home
288: Community Forums
289: Community Forums
290: Community Forums
291: Photo Gallery
292: Photo Gallery
293: Home
294: Community Forums
295: Home
296: Home
297: Community Forums
298: Community Forums
299: Community Forums
300: Community Forums
301: Home
302: Photo Gallery
303: Community Forums
304: Community Forums
305: Community Forums
306: Community Forums
307: Home
308: Statistics
309: Member Screenshots
310: Home
311: Community Forums
312: Community Forums
313: Community Forums
314: Community Forums
315: Community Forums
316: Photo Gallery
317: Community Forums
318: Community Forums
319: Home
320: Community Forums
321: Photo Gallery
322: Photo Gallery
323: Home
324: Home
325: Community Forums
326: Downloads
327: Home
328: Community Forums
329: Statistics
330: Home
331: Community Forums
332: Community Forums
333: Community Forums
334: Downloads
335: Community Forums
336: Photo Gallery
337: Community Forums
338: Photo Gallery
339: Home
340: Home
341: Community Forums
342: Community Forums
343: Home
344: Your Account
345: Member Screenshots
346: Photo Gallery
347: Downloads
348: Photo Gallery
349: Community Forums
350: Community Forums
351: Home
352: Community Forums
353: Community Forums
354: Community Forums
355: Community Forums
356: Community Forums
357: Community Forums
358: Downloads
359: Downloads
360: Community Forums
361: Photo Gallery
362: Downloads
363: Photo Gallery
364: Community Forums
365: Home
366: Community Forums
367: Photo Gallery
368: Downloads
369: Community Forums
370: Community Forums
371: Your Account
372: News Archive
373: Community Forums
374: Community Forums
375: Statistics
376: Community Forums
377: CPGlang
378: Community Forums
379: Community Forums
380: Community Forums
381: Photo Gallery
382: Home
383: Downloads
384: Member Screenshots
385: Home
386: Community Forums
387: Community Forums
388: Your Account
389: Downloads
390: Photo Gallery
391: Community Forums
392: Community Forums
393: Community Forums
394: Community Forums
395: Community Forums
396: Member Screenshots
397: Community Forums
398: Member Screenshots
399: Community Forums
400: Community Forums
401: Community Forums
402: Community Forums
403: Photo Gallery
404: Community Forums
405: Photo Gallery
406: Community Forums
407: Community Forums
408: Home
409: Photo Gallery
410: Community Forums
411: Photo Gallery
412: Community Forums
413: Home
414: Your Account
415: Photo Gallery
416: Downloads
417: Community Forums
418: Community Forums
419: Community Forums
420: Community Forums
421: Community Forums
422: Your Account
423: Home
424: Community Forums
425: Community Forums
426: CPGlang
427: Home
428: Community Forums
429: Photo Gallery
430: Photo Gallery
431: Community Forums
432: Community Forums
433: Photo Gallery
434: Community Forums
435: Community Forums
436: Home
437: Home
438: Community Forums
439: Community Forums
440: Community Forums
441: Your Account
442: Community Forums
443: Photo Gallery
444: Photo Gallery
445: Community Forums
446: Community Forums
447: Photo Gallery
448: Photo Gallery
449: Community Forums
450: Community Forums
451: Home
452: Statistics
453: Photo Gallery
454: Downloads
455: Community Forums
456: Community Forums
457: Community Forums
458: Community Forums
459: Photo Gallery
460: Community Forums
461: Community Forums
462: Home
463: Community Forums
464: Community Forums
465: Home
466: Community Forums
467: Photo Gallery
468: Downloads
469: Community Forums
470: Community Forums
471: Community Forums
472: Community Forums
473: Photo Gallery
474: News Archive
475: Community Forums
476: Community Forums
477: Community Forums
478: Photo Gallery
479: Photo Gallery
480: Downloads
481: Community Forums
482: Community Forums
483: Home
484: Downloads
485: Community Forums
486: Community Forums
487: Photo Gallery
488: Community Forums
489: Community Forums
490: Photo Gallery
491: Community Forums
492: Community Forums
493: Member Screenshots
494: News Archive
495: Community Forums
496: Community Forums
497: Community Forums
498: Member Screenshots
499: Photo Gallery
500: Community Forums
501: Community Forums
502: Community Forums
503: Community Forums
504: Community Forums
505: Photo Gallery
506: Community Forums
507: Community Forums
508: Community Forums
509: Community Forums
510: Community Forums
511: Community Forums
512: Photo Gallery
513: Community Forums
514: Home
515: Community Forums
516: News Archive
517: Community Forums
518: Community Forums
519: Community Forums
520: Community Forums
521: Community Forums
522: Home
523: Community Forums
524: Community Forums
525: Community Forums
526: Photo Gallery
527: Your Account
528: Community Forums
529: Community Forums
530: Community Forums
531: Photo Gallery
532: Community Forums
533: Community Forums
534: Photo Gallery
535: Home
536: News
537: CPGlang
538: Photo Gallery
539: Home
540: Community Forums
541: Photo Gallery
542: Community Forums
543: Downloads
544: Home
545: Community Forums
546: Community Forums
547: Community Forums
548: Photo Gallery
549: Community Forums
550: Photo Gallery
551: Community Forums
552: Community Forums
553: Community Forums
554: Photo Gallery
555: Community Forums
556: Community Forums
557: Community Forums
558: Community Forums
559: Photo Gallery
560: Community Forums
561: Community Forums
562: Community Forums
563: Community Forums
564: Community Forums
565: Photo Gallery
566: Community Forums
567: Community Forums
568: Photo Gallery
569: Community Forums
570: Community Forums
571: Community Forums
572: Community Forums
573: Community Forums
574: Home
575: Photo Gallery
576: Downloads
577: Community Forums
578: Community Forums

Staff Online:

No staff members are online!
Trophy-- anit-RPG technology?
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page     Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board

View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
SHAWN
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 31, 2006
Posts: 484

PostPosted: Tue Jan 09, 2007 10:52 pm
Post subject: Trophy-- anit-RPG technology?

okay fellas, happened to catch the tail end report on the news this evening in re: an anti-RPG system or something. it was developed by the IDF, called Trophy?

do any of you who know more about this, feel that you can comment, shed more light on how this is supposed to work?

shawn
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
JimWeb
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1439
Location: The back of beyond
PostPosted: Tue Jan 09, 2007 11:30 pm
Post subject: Re: Trophy-- anit-RPG technology?

Not adopted by anyone yet as it is useless in built-up areas and poses a hazard to any of the dismounts around the vehicle. It is strictly a wide-open spaces and everyone under armour system.

TRAPS is a much better system that can be used even with personnel stood beside it...

Cool

_________________
TTFN
Jim

If your not a member of JED then your
not serious about anything military..

***********************
www.jedsite.info
JED Military Equipment
***********************
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website ICQ Number
Shadow_Banshee
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Feb 03, 2005
Posts: 575

PostPosted: Wed Jan 10, 2007 1:05 am
Post subject: Re: Trophy-- anit-RPG technology?

maybe this might be intresting, i checked and its ok to link to it, www.thesop.org/index.php?id=878 i was recently discusing this with a IDF friend so the link was handy. hope it helps.

_________________
Lay me place and bake me Pie
I'm starving for me Gravy
Back to top
View user's profile
mike_Duplessis
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 236

PostPosted: Wed Jan 10, 2007 3:51 pm
Post subject: Re: Trophy-- anit-RPG technology?

I believe Trophy may have seen some limited use in Lebanon last year. There's been a recent media stink about the U.S. turning its nose up to Trophy in favor of a home-grown version that's still pretty far down the road.

My own ill-informed concern with Trophy is its electronic footprint. Radars scannning for incoming rockets sounds like an opponent should be able to pick up and isolate vehicle signatures from miles away. 'Captain, I'm reading three Trophy signatures off the port bow!"
Back to top
View user's profile
SHAWN
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 31, 2006
Posts: 484

PostPosted: Wed Jan 10, 2007 5:13 pm
Post subject: Re: Trophy-- anit-RPG technology?

thanks, i know i am not the only one who feels this way, the media can get my blood boiling...

oh my goodness, i cant believe i was going to use this term, the "drive-by" media, lisa meyers or whomever she was, reported on the trophy system,
presenting views and opinions that i dont feel are accurate, trying to make the govt or army out to be the bad guys and not putting the lives of the soldier first, blah, blah, blah.

this type of defense has some good pros, but too many cons at the present...
this is the first i have heard of it. sounds viable, but how useful would it really be?
seems like sci-fi, force fields around vehicles and such, seems cool


the story had mentioned something to do with an auto-loader, how did that fit into the system?

thanks for shedding some light on this for me, and for the link. i will check it out.
shawn
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Neil_Baumgardner
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 3942
Location: Arlington, VA
PostPosted: Wed Jan 10, 2007 5:23 pm
Post subject: Re: Trophy-- anit-RPG technology?

Army Committed to Force Protection, Not False Security
By Jim Garamone
American Forces Press Service

WASHINGTON, Sept. 8, 2006 – Army leaders are committed to ensuring soldiers have the best force-protection capability possible, but also want to avoid giving soldiers a false sense of security, service officials said here today.

Maj. Gen. Jeffrey A, Sorenson, the Army’s deputy for acquisition and systems management, took exception to an NBC News report that said the Army is not buying an Israeli system, called Trophy, that could protect soldiers and their vehicles from rocket-propelled grenades. The report alleges the Army manipulated information in favor of a competing Raytheon system, called Quick Kill.

Both the Israeli and Raytheon systems are designed to fire missiles that intercept RPGs in flight. The Israeli system may be six months ahead of the Raytheon system, but it has limitations. The NBC report made it sound as if the Army refused to field a perfectly fine combat system that would save lives, officials said.

Sorenson said they system is not a “produceable item.� The Israelis have been working on the Trophy system for 10 or 11 years, Sorenson said. “If this thing was ready to go, my question would be, why wasn’t it on the particular tanks that went into Lebanon?� he said. No Israeli Merkava tanks carried the Trophy system, he said.

Other problems include the fact that the system right now has no reloading capability. Once it fires, that side of the vehicle is vulnerable. Which brings up another shortcoming: the Trophy can only be mounted to protect one axis. This means officials would have to mount multiple missile systems on every vehicle. The Quick Kill missile has 360-degree capability and a reload capability.

Another worry is collateral damage, he said. “In a tight urban area, the Trophy system may take out the RPG, but we may kill 20 people in the process,� Sorenson said. “That is a concern we have that we haven’t fully evaluated.�

The general said there also is confusion on the contract award. “It was awarded by the lead system integrator and the government team,� Sorenson said. “It was not done by Raytheon. There was confusion in the report that the Army was cooking the books and which was absolutely false, blatantly false.�

Sorenson said the Army has standards of performance for force-protection capabilities. “These have not only been dictated by lessons learned in theater, but all the work we have done heretofore on all the systems prior to this,� he said. “We will not put anything out there that has not demonstrated that it is capable of doing what it is alleged to do.�

The bottom line is that if a system “does not have the ‘Good Housekeeping Seal of Approval’ it does not go forward,� Sorenson said.

The general said that every soldier lost is a tragedy. But, of the more than 1,400 soldiers killed in Iraq, most died from improvised explosive devices. A total of 148 soldiers have been lost due to an RPG or an RPG and other weapons. Sixty-three soldiers died by RPG only, he said. Broken down further, 10 soldiers died as a result of an RPG hit to a U.S. combat system -- an Abrams tank, Bradley fighting vehicle, Stryker wheeled vehicle or M-113 armored personnel carrier.

“The reason that is so low is that those combat systems already have good force-protection systems applied,� Sorenson said. There are reactive armor tiles on the Bradley. Officials added slat-armor protection to the Stryker, and all combat vehicles have protection built into them, officials said.
Back to top
View user's profile
mike_Duplessis
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 236

PostPosted: Wed Jan 10, 2007 6:30 pm
Post subject: Re: Trophy-- anit-RPG technology?

Some describe the debate as a contest between a high-tech one-shot reactive system that may cost more than the vehicle itself vs a cheap steel cage with bars spaced 3 inches apart. of course a cheap steel cage doesn't boost Raytheon profit margin.

D'oh! I almost forgot to mention. Our gracious host 'AFV News' had a brief article on Trophy in its journal a short while ago. Is your magazine subscription up-to-date? Wink
Back to top
View user's profile
mike_Duplessis
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 236

PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 1:58 pm
Post subject: Re: Trophy-- anit-RPG technology?

Ah! By sheer coincidence I got home from work early last night, just in time to see an NBC news report pretty darned critical of Pentagon procurement in regards to Trophy. Not that they didn't field it, more that they did everything possible to keep from even looking at it! So the old story's still got legs.
Back to top
View user's profile
bsmart
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 2523
Location: Central Maryland
PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 3:23 pm
Post subject: Re: Trophy-- anit-RPG technology?

I saw the story on NBC also. It was a pretty pointed and damning piece. Their focus was 'Army Does everything it can to keep from testing a system which may save soldiers lives to protect the FCS program which their (The Armys) favored contractor is developing' Including the old 'The Army refused our requests for interviews' which NEVER plays well.

Also nothing about cost or potential danger to dismounts (Which is the big problem I've always felt was there with active/reactive systems)

_________________
Bob Smart (bsmart@xecu.net)
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Joe_D
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 29, 2006
Posts: 2066
Location: Razorback Country
PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 7:23 pm
Post subject: Re: Trophy-- anit-RPG technology?

Nobody's mentioned Humvee Protection,
Just curious if it would apply to them, since the majority of the traffic is of those type of vehicles. Pardon my ignorance but can it be used with a crewmember exposed in an open cupola??? If not the value would be even less. I will say that protective upgrades are happening all the time and as soon as you get used to one another comes out even better. IED's are the most common and biggest killer. RPG's can mess your day up, but at least there's a person you can kill if he tries to engage you. Can't fight an IED.
Did not see the NBC program, kinda glad I don't have regular access to it based on what everyone has said. Let's hope this story doesn't end up prompting some Congressman to start another uneccesary investigation that will either buy us a system we don't really need and siphon off funds needed elsewhere (Counter IED) or prevent the fielding of one in a timely manner that does work.

Joe D
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page    Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board
Page 1 of 1
All times are GMT - 6 Hours



Jump to:  


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum