±Recent Visitors

Recent Visitors to Com-Central!

±User Info-big


Welcome Anonymous

Nickname
Password

Membership:
Latest: cgsimpson
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Overall: 6645

People Online:
Members: 0
Visitors: 584
Total: 584
Who Is Where:
 Visitors:
01: Home
02: Home
03: Your Account
04: Home
05: Community Forums
06: Photo Gallery
07: Community Forums
08: Community Forums
09: Community Forums
10: Your Account
11: Photo Gallery
12: Community Forums
13: Community Forums
14: Community Forums
15: Photo Gallery
16: Photo Gallery
17: Community Forums
18: Community Forums
19: Photo Gallery
20: Community Forums
21: Community Forums
22: Community Forums
23: Photo Gallery
24: Member Screenshots
25: Photo Gallery
26: Community Forums
27: Photo Gallery
28: Home
29: Community Forums
30: Community Forums
31: Your Account
32: Your Account
33: Photo Gallery
34: Community Forums
35: Community Forums
36: Community Forums
37: Photo Gallery
38: Photo Gallery
39: Community Forums
40: Community Forums
41: Community Forums
42: Community Forums
43: Community Forums
44: Community Forums
45: Community Forums
46: Downloads
47: Community Forums
48: Community Forums
49: Photo Gallery
50: Downloads
51: Community Forums
52: Community Forums
53: Community Forums
54: Photo Gallery
55: Community Forums
56: Community Forums
57: Member Screenshots
58: Community Forums
59: Home
60: Community Forums
61: Community Forums
62: Community Forums
63: Community Forums
64: Community Forums
65: Downloads
66: Community Forums
67: Photo Gallery
68: Downloads
69: Statistics
70: Community Forums
71: Home
72: Community Forums
73: Photo Gallery
74: Community Forums
75: Photo Gallery
76: Member Screenshots
77: Community Forums
78: Home
79: Community Forums
80: Community Forums
81: Community Forums
82: Community Forums
83: Community Forums
84: Photo Gallery
85: Community Forums
86: Community Forums
87: Community Forums
88: Community Forums
89: Home
90: Community Forums
91: Community Forums
92: Community Forums
93: Community Forums
94: Photo Gallery
95: Community Forums
96: Home
97: Member Screenshots
98: Community Forums
99: Photo Gallery
100: Community Forums
101: News
102: Home
103: Community Forums
104: Community Forums
105: Community Forums
106: CPGlang
107: Community Forums
108: Community Forums
109: Home
110: Community Forums
111: Photo Gallery
112: Photo Gallery
113: Community Forums
114: Photo Gallery
115: Community Forums
116: Community Forums
117: Downloads
118: Photo Gallery
119: Community Forums
120: Community Forums
121: CPGlang
122: Community Forums
123: Downloads
124: Community Forums
125: Photo Gallery
126: Community Forums
127: Community Forums
128: Community Forums
129: Community Forums
130: Community Forums
131: Community Forums
132: Community Forums
133: Community Forums
134: Community Forums
135: Community Forums
136: Community Forums
137: Community Forums
138: Community Forums
139: CPGlang
140: Photo Gallery
141: Photo Gallery
142: Community Forums
143: Community Forums
144: Community Forums
145: Community Forums
146: Home
147: Community Forums
148: Community Forums
149: Community Forums
150: Home
151: Community Forums
152: Community Forums
153: Community Forums
154: Photo Gallery
155: Community Forums
156: Home
157: Photo Gallery
158: Community Forums
159: Community Forums
160: Home
161: Community Forums
162: CPGlang
163: Member Screenshots
164: Community Forums
165: Community Forums
166: Your Account
167: Photo Gallery
168: Community Forums
169: Photo Gallery
170: Community Forums
171: Your Account
172: Community Forums
173: Community Forums
174: Photo Gallery
175: Community Forums
176: Community Forums
177: Home
178: Community Forums
179: Member Screenshots
180: Community Forums
181: Community Forums
182: Community Forums
183: Photo Gallery
184: Community Forums
185: Community Forums
186: Home
187: Home
188: Photo Gallery
189: Community Forums
190: Community Forums
191: Community Forums
192: Photo Gallery
193: Downloads
194: Community Forums
195: Community Forums
196: Community Forums
197: Photo Gallery
198: Photo Gallery
199: Downloads
200: Community Forums
201: Community Forums
202: Downloads
203: Community Forums
204: Community Forums
205: Photo Gallery
206: Community Forums
207: Community Forums
208: Community Forums
209: Community Forums
210: Downloads
211: Photo Gallery
212: Community Forums
213: Photo Gallery
214: Photo Gallery
215: Community Forums
216: Home
217: Home
218: Community Forums
219: Photo Gallery
220: Photo Gallery
221: Community Forums
222: Photo Gallery
223: Community Forums
224: Member Screenshots
225: Community Forums
226: Community Forums
227: Community Forums
228: Downloads
229: Community Forums
230: Photo Gallery
231: Community Forums
232: Community Forums
233: Community Forums
234: Statistics
235: Photo Gallery
236: Community Forums
237: Home
238: Photo Gallery
239: Community Forums
240: CPGlang
241: Community Forums
242: Photo Gallery
243: Community Forums
244: Community Forums
245: Community Forums
246: Community Forums
247: Member Screenshots
248: Photo Gallery
249: Community Forums
250: Community Forums
251: Community Forums
252: Community Forums
253: Your Account
254: Photo Gallery
255: Member Screenshots
256: Photo Gallery
257: Home
258: Photo Gallery
259: Community Forums
260: Home
261: Community Forums
262: Home
263: Community Forums
264: Community Forums
265: Photo Gallery
266: Community Forums
267: Community Forums
268: Photo Gallery
269: Community Forums
270: Photo Gallery
271: Photo Gallery
272: Community Forums
273: Community Forums
274: Community Forums
275: Community Forums
276: Photo Gallery
277: Home
278: Community Forums
279: Community Forums
280: Community Forums
281: Photo Gallery
282: Home
283: Community Forums
284: Community Forums
285: Photo Gallery
286: Home
287: Community Forums
288: Your Account
289: Photo Gallery
290: Community Forums
291: Community Forums
292: CPGlang
293: Community Forums
294: Community Forums
295: Photo Gallery
296: Community Forums
297: Community Forums
298: Photo Gallery
299: Community Forums
300: Community Forums
301: Community Forums
302: Community Forums
303: Community Forums
304: Community Forums
305: Community Forums
306: Community Forums
307: Community Forums
308: Photo Gallery
309: Community Forums
310: Home
311: Community Forums
312: Photo Gallery
313: Community Forums
314: Community Forums
315: Community Forums
316: Home
317: Community Forums
318: Community Forums
319: Community Forums
320: Community Forums
321: Home
322: Community Forums
323: Home
324: Your Account
325: Home
326: Home
327: Community Forums
328: Home
329: Photo Gallery
330: Community Forums
331: Community Forums
332: Community Forums
333: Community Forums
334: Home
335: Photo Gallery
336: Community Forums
337: Community Forums
338: Community Forums
339: Community Forums
340: Photo Gallery
341: Community Forums
342: Community Forums
343: Community Forums
344: Community Forums
345: Community Forums
346: Community Forums
347: Photo Gallery
348: Community Forums
349: Photo Gallery
350: Community Forums
351: Photo Gallery
352: Community Forums
353: Photo Gallery
354: Community Forums
355: Community Forums
356: Home
357: Community Forums
358: Home
359: Community Forums
360: Photo Gallery
361: Home
362: Photo Gallery
363: Community Forums
364: Your Account
365: Community Forums
366: Community Forums
367: Home
368: Community Forums
369: Community Forums
370: Community Forums
371: Community Forums
372: Community Forums
373: Photo Gallery
374: Community Forums
375: Community Forums
376: Community Forums
377: Community Forums
378: Home
379: Community Forums
380: Community Forums
381: Community Forums
382: Community Forums
383: Community Forums
384: Community Forums
385: Photo Gallery
386: Community Forums
387: Community Forums
388: Community Forums
389: Community Forums
390: Community Forums
391: Downloads
392: Community Forums
393: Community Forums
394: Downloads
395: Home
396: Member Screenshots
397: Photo Gallery
398: Home
399: Home
400: Community Forums
401: Community Forums
402: Community Forums
403: Downloads
404: News
405: Community Forums
406: Community Forums
407: Photo Gallery
408: Community Forums
409: Photo Gallery
410: Photo Gallery
411: Member Screenshots
412: Member Screenshots
413: Photo Gallery
414: Community Forums
415: Home
416: Community Forums
417: Community Forums
418: Community Forums
419: Community Forums
420: Community Forums
421: Community Forums
422: Statistics
423: Community Forums
424: Community Forums
425: Photo Gallery
426: Home
427: Home
428: Community Forums
429: Community Forums
430: Home
431: Photo Gallery
432: Community Forums
433: Community Forums
434: Community Forums
435: Home
436: Community Forums
437: Home
438: Photo Gallery
439: Community Forums
440: Home
441: Community Forums
442: Your Account
443: Community Forums
444: Community Forums
445: Community Forums
446: Community Forums
447: Photo Gallery
448: Community Forums
449: Community Forums
450: Photo Gallery
451: Community Forums
452: Community Forums
453: Member Screenshots
454: CPGlang
455: Photo Gallery
456: Community Forums
457: Community Forums
458: Community Forums
459: Home
460: Community Forums
461: Downloads
462: Community Forums
463: Community Forums
464: CPGlang
465: Community Forums
466: Community Forums
467: Community Forums
468: Community Forums
469: Community Forums
470: Home
471: Community Forums
472: Photo Gallery
473: Home
474: Community Forums
475: Community Forums
476: Photo Gallery
477: Community Forums
478: Community Forums
479: Community Forums
480: Community Forums
481: Community Forums
482: Home
483: Community Forums
484: Community Forums
485: Community Forums
486: Photo Gallery
487: Community Forums
488: Community Forums
489: Photo Gallery
490: Home
491: Community Forums
492: Home
493: Community Forums
494: Community Forums
495: Community Forums
496: Community Forums
497: Statistics
498: Community Forums
499: Community Forums
500: Community Forums
501: Community Forums
502: Home
503: Community Forums
504: Downloads
505: Your Account
506: Community Forums
507: Community Forums
508: Photo Gallery
509: Home
510: Community Forums
511: Community Forums
512: Member Screenshots
513: Home
514: Photo Gallery
515: Photo Gallery
516: Community Forums
517: Downloads
518: Home
519: Community Forums
520: Community Forums
521: Community Forums
522: Community Forums
523: Community Forums
524: Community Forums
525: Community Forums
526: Home
527: Statistics
528: Community Forums
529: Community Forums
530: Your Account
531: Photo Gallery
532: Community Forums
533: Community Forums
534: Community Forums
535: Photo Gallery
536: Downloads
537: Community Forums
538: Community Forums
539: Home
540: Home
541: Community Forums
542: Community Forums
543: Community Forums
544: Community Forums
545: Community Forums
546: Community Forums
547: Community Forums
548: Search
549: Photo Gallery
550: Community Forums
551: Downloads
552: Community Forums
553: Community Forums
554: Community Forums
555: Home
556: Community Forums
557: Community Forums
558: Community Forums
559: Home
560: Community Forums
561: Member Screenshots
562: Downloads
563: Community Forums
564: Downloads
565: Community Forums
566: Community Forums
567: Community Forums
568: Home
569: Community Forums
570: Your Account
571: Community Forums
572: Community Forums
573: Community Forums
574: Home
575: Home
576: Community Forums
577: Home
578: Home
579: Downloads
580: Home
581: Photo Gallery
582: Community Forums
583: Downloads
584: Community Forums

Staff Online:

No staff members are online!
Top Ten Tanks-- slam the M1 Abrams
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page     Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board

View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
SHAWN
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 31, 2006
Posts: 484

PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 2:17 am
Post subject: Top Ten Tanks-- slam the M1 Abrams

the military channel had the top ten tanks on (again?).
i know it is entertainment but i cant stand to watch much of it. his opinion is given on many of their programs, dr. ayer nusbacher, slammed the M1. slammed it over many of the other p.o.s. that made their list.
due to the logistics and he called it a "parade of softskin vehicles" to support the M1, he said taking it into battle is like "having one foot in a bucket". and having to support the tiger tank wasnt...
they put the T54 over the Merkava... they put the Mk1 as 4th...
the panther didnt even make the list...

i just dont get it....
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
bsmart
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 2523
Location: Central Maryland
PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 9:50 am
Post subject: Re: Top Ten Tanks-- slam the M1 Abrams

Where did the Sherman and the T34 end up? Did the M60 make the list? What about Centurion

Do you remember what their criteria was? Maybe we should run a thread where we come up with our own 'Top 10' using either their criteria or some other agreed on attributes.

I think I agree with the T54 over the Merkava, but it could depend on the criteria.

_________________
Bob Smart (bsmart@xecu.net)


Last edited by bsmart on Wed Jan 30, 2008 5:49 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
oldertop
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Oct 20, 2006
Posts: 76

PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 12:35 pm
Post subject: Re: Top Ten Tanks-- slam the M1 Abrams

The M4 was number 10 and the T34 number one, the placement was based on some strange scaled system. for some reason they have been harping on the fuel consumption of the M1 lately because of its turbine engine..oh ya and they list the range of the Tiger (they show pics of both I and II) at about 120 miles (there wasn't a Tiger operating during battlefield operation that got 90 miles on a full load of fuel, the docs I read (German) put it at a average range at 83 miles, which by the way was about the same the Marines were getting with the gasoline fueled 62.5 ton M103 heavy tank..who are these "experts" who think you should get great mileage from a heavy tank.
Back to top
View user's profile
JeffStringer
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 637

PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 2:26 pm
Post subject: Re: Top Ten Tanks-- slam the M1 Abrams

Strictly for entertainment for sure. Confused
Back to top
View user's profile
Rikard_Hufschmied
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 458
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 2:29 pm
Post subject: Re: Top Ten Tanks-- slam the M1 Abrams

- bsmart
What about Centurian


I can hold it no longer, no offense Bob, it is CENTURION ... period!

_________________
Frustra Nate Vive Devincere
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Dubliner
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 94

PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 3:27 pm
Post subject: Re: Top Ten Tanks-- slam the M1 Abrams

When people pitch these kinds of shows to the networks there is always a push to offer something new and "edgy." History has to be revisited and some new overlooked deeper truth found. Even when military experts are used the experts have only seen most of the vehicles in action in archival films or at an event at Bovington or Saumur. They may know the history, but they seldom have an understanding of how the units that used the vehicles operated on a day to day basis. Veteran interviews are used for emotional "hooks" or to reinforce the preordained message.
Back to top
View user's profile
bsmart
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 2523
Location: Central Maryland
PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 5:56 pm
Post subject: Re: Top Ten Tanks-- slam the M1 Abrams

- Rikard_Hufschmied
- bsmart
What about Centurian


I can hold it no longer, no offense Bob, it is CENTURION ... period!


Noted and corrected. All I can say is that it was early and I was not fully awake (Don't tell my boss)
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Hellfish6
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Apr 09, 2006
Posts: 151
Location: Orlando
PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 7:06 pm
Post subject: Re: Top Ten Tanks-- slam the M1 Abrams

Like I said in the M113 thread, it's about how successful a vehicle is, not about how effective it is. The T34 was in service well into the 90s in some places, has fought in more wars than just about any tank, and was produced in vast numbers. It's not nearly equivalent to the Abrams in effectiveness, but it is one of the most important AFVs ever produced and was designed well enough to last well beyond the age it was designed for.
Back to top
View user's profile
JeffStringer
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 637

PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 8:54 pm
Post subject: Re: Top Ten Tanks-- slam the M1 Abrams

Not to cause anymore grief, but this list leaves out one factor. The most important AFV. I would believe that the M4 chassis was more important than any other vehicle the US had at any time.

Giving it the number 10 nod was only by their rating system. If that was altered or changed the outcome would be completely different.
Back to top
View user's profile
oldertop
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Oct 20, 2006
Posts: 76

PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 9:40 pm
Post subject: Re: Top Ten Tanks-- slam the M1 Abrams

If you look at it from "in uses" point of view..Why wouldn't the M48 be listed up there at the or near the top..after all the M60 was just a modfiyed and up-graded M48 not unlike the T54,55, and 62s and the M60 is still being used as a frontline main battletank to this day 60 years after its introduction. They argue that the M1 hasen't faced its equivalent in battle but yet they rate the Tiger that never fought its equal in armor and firepower, lease of all the M26 or any of the KV or JS, and the Tiger was never built in any great numbers, far less than the M1.
Back to top
View user's profile
SHAWN
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 31, 2006
Posts: 484

PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 10:13 pm
Post subject: Re: Top Ten Tanks-- slam the M1 Abrams

yes, i dont care for their faulty/contradicting criteria...
part of their judging scale is a "fear factor".
what did they use, they had 5 categories (?)... production rate, fear factor, armor/armament, innovation, ?
mechanical reliability should be on their list of criteria...
they graded on a big curve....

the centurion was number 5 or 6...
no pattons made the list...
the panzer IV was 7 (?)... over the M4 even considering its evolution into the Easy 8, etc.....

anyway, even though it got my feathers ruffled, it was entertaining!!!
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
JeffStringer
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 637

PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 11:30 pm
Post subject: Re: Top Ten Tanks-- slam the M1 Abrams

I guess the 'Fear Factor' is all about if you were in another tank.

I don't know about you, but if I were on foot I would just about fear any tank no matter how thick the armor was!
Back to top
View user's profile
Roy_A_Lingle
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1997
Location: El Paso & Ft Bliss, Texas
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2008 6:20 pm
Post subject: Re: Top Ten Tanks-- slam the M1 Abrams

Hi Shawn! Hi Folks!

- SHAWN

the military channel had the top ten tanks on (again?).
slammed the M1. slammed it over many of the other p.o.s....
due to the logistics and he called it a "parade of softskin vehicles" to support the M1, he said taking it into battle is like "having one foot in a bucket".
i just dont get it....


Ever sense the M1 was fielded, it has NEVER been judged as THE BEST because of it's high fuel consumption. There is nothing new about that shows position on the Abrams.

Old news folks!
Sgt, Scouts Out!

_________________
"You can never have too much reconnaissance."
General G.S. Patton Jr.
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
LeeW
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 26, 2006
Posts: 61

PostPosted: Tue Feb 05, 2008 11:25 am
Post subject: Re: Top Ten Tanks-- slam the M1 Abrams

On the other hand some have claimed it is the best in spite of its high fuel consumption. All depends on what you consider and how you weight the various factors.
Back to top
View user's profile
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page    Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board
Page 1 of 1
All times are GMT - 6 Hours



Jump to:  


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum