±Recent Visitors

Recent Visitors to Com-Central!

±User Info-big


Welcome Anonymous

Nickname
Password

Membership:
Latest: cgsimpson
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Overall: 6645

People Online:
Members: 0
Visitors: 586
Total: 586
Who Is Where:
 Visitors:
01: Community Forums
02: Home
03: Community Forums
04: Home
05: Community Forums
06: Community Forums
07: Member Screenshots
08: Community Forums
09: Community Forums
10: Community Forums
11: Community Forums
12: Statistics
13: Photo Gallery
14: Community Forums
15: Community Forums
16: Photo Gallery
17: Downloads
18: Community Forums
19: Community Forums
20: Community Forums
21: Community Forums
22: Community Forums
23: Community Forums
24: Community Forums
25: Treasury
26: Community Forums
27: Community Forums
28: Community Forums
29: Community Forums
30: Community Forums
31: Home
32: Downloads
33: Downloads
34: Community Forums
35: Home
36: Community Forums
37: Photo Gallery
38: Community Forums
39: Community Forums
40: Home
41: Community Forums
42: Community Forums
43: Downloads
44: Home
45: Community Forums
46: Your Account
47: Community Forums
48: Community Forums
49: Photo Gallery
50: Photo Gallery
51: Home
52: Community Forums
53: Community Forums
54: Community Forums
55: Statistics
56: Community Forums
57: Photo Gallery
58: Community Forums
59: Community Forums
60: Community Forums
61: Community Forums
62: Photo Gallery
63: Community Forums
64: Community Forums
65: Community Forums
66: Home
67: Community Forums
68: Community Forums
69: Community Forums
70: Statistics
71: Community Forums
72: Community Forums
73: Photo Gallery
74: Community Forums
75: Downloads
76: Member Screenshots
77: Community Forums
78: Community Forums
79: Community Forums
80: Downloads
81: Home
82: Member Screenshots
83: Photo Gallery
84: Community Forums
85: Community Forums
86: Photo Gallery
87: Photo Gallery
88: Community Forums
89: Community Forums
90: Photo Gallery
91: Community Forums
92: Community Forums
93: Community Forums
94: Member Screenshots
95: Community Forums
96: Community Forums
97: Downloads
98: Community Forums
99: Community Forums
100: CPGlang
101: CPGlang
102: Community Forums
103: Community Forums
104: Community Forums
105: Community Forums
106: CPGlang
107: Community Forums
108: Home
109: Community Forums
110: Community Forums
111: Community Forums
112: Community Forums
113: Community Forums
114: Community Forums
115: Photo Gallery
116: Community Forums
117: Home
118: Downloads
119: Community Forums
120: Photo Gallery
121: Photo Gallery
122: Home
123: Community Forums
124: Community Forums
125: Community Forums
126: Community Forums
127: Search
128: Community Forums
129: Community Forums
130: Photo Gallery
131: Community Forums
132: Community Forums
133: Home
134: Community Forums
135: Community Forums
136: Community Forums
137: Community Forums
138: Photo Gallery
139: Home
140: Photo Gallery
141: Community Forums
142: Community Forums
143: Photo Gallery
144: Downloads
145: Member Screenshots
146: Photo Gallery
147: Photo Gallery
148: Home
149: Community Forums
150: Downloads
151: Community Forums
152: Community Forums
153: Community Forums
154: Photo Gallery
155: Photo Gallery
156: CPGlang
157: Community Forums
158: Community Forums
159: Photo Gallery
160: Statistics
161: Photo Gallery
162: Community Forums
163: Community Forums
164: Community Forums
165: Home
166: Photo Gallery
167: Community Forums
168: Community Forums
169: Photo Gallery
170: Community Forums
171: Community Forums
172: Community Forums
173: Home
174: Photo Gallery
175: Community Forums
176: Community Forums
177: Community Forums
178: Home
179: Community Forums
180: Community Forums
181: Community Forums
182: Home
183: Community Forums
184: Photo Gallery
185: Photo Gallery
186: Community Forums
187: Photo Gallery
188: Community Forums
189: Community Forums
190: Photo Gallery
191: Community Forums
192: CPGlang
193: Community Forums
194: Home
195: Photo Gallery
196: Photo Gallery
197: Community Forums
198: Community Forums
199: Home
200: Community Forums
201: Photo Gallery
202: Photo Gallery
203: Community Forums
204: Community Forums
205: Community Forums
206: Community Forums
207: CPGlang
208: Photo Gallery
209: Home
210: Community Forums
211: Your Account
212: Home
213: Community Forums
214: Home
215: Your Account
216: Community Forums
217: Community Forums
218: Community Forums
219: Home
220: Community Forums
221: Community Forums
222: Photo Gallery
223: Community Forums
224: Community Forums
225: Community Forums
226: Photo Gallery
227: Community Forums
228: Community Forums
229: Community Forums
230: Community Forums
231: Photo Gallery
232: Community Forums
233: Community Forums
234: Community Forums
235: Home
236: Community Forums
237: Community Forums
238: Photo Gallery
239: Community Forums
240: Downloads
241: Home
242: Community Forums
243: Community Forums
244: Downloads
245: CPGlang
246: Community Forums
247: Community Forums
248: Home
249: Community Forums
250: Community Forums
251: Community Forums
252: Community Forums
253: Home
254: Community Forums
255: Community Forums
256: Community Forums
257: Downloads
258: Photo Gallery
259: Home
260: Community Forums
261: Community Forums
262: Home
263: Photo Gallery
264: Community Forums
265: Community Forums
266: Community Forums
267: Community Forums
268: Community Forums
269: Home
270: Home
271: Community Forums
272: Community Forums
273: Community Forums
274: Community Forums
275: Community Forums
276: Photo Gallery
277: Home
278: Community Forums
279: Photo Gallery
280: Your Account
281: Photo Gallery
282: Community Forums
283: Community Forums
284: Community Forums
285: Community Forums
286: Community Forums
287: Community Forums
288: Photo Gallery
289: Community Forums
290: Home
291: Community Forums
292: Community Forums
293: Photo Gallery
294: Community Forums
295: Downloads
296: Community Forums
297: Community Forums
298: Community Forums
299: News
300: Community Forums
301: Community Forums
302: Community Forums
303: Photo Gallery
304: Community Forums
305: Photo Gallery
306: Community Forums
307: Community Forums
308: Community Forums
309: Downloads
310: Member Screenshots
311: Community Forums
312: Community Forums
313: Community Forums
314: Community Forums
315: Downloads
316: Community Forums
317: Downloads
318: Community Forums
319: Photo Gallery
320: Community Forums
321: Community Forums
322: Community Forums
323: Community Forums
324: Community Forums
325: Community Forums
326: Community Forums
327: Downloads
328: Community Forums
329: Photo Gallery
330: Community Forums
331: Photo Gallery
332: Community Forums
333: Community Forums
334: CPGlang
335: Community Forums
336: Community Forums
337: Photo Gallery
338: Community Forums
339: Community Forums
340: Community Forums
341: Community Forums
342: Community Forums
343: Home
344: Photo Gallery
345: Community Forums
346: Downloads
347: Community Forums
348: Community Forums
349: Community Forums
350: Community Forums
351: Community Forums
352: Community Forums
353: Community Forums
354: Community Forums
355: Community Forums
356: Home
357: Community Forums
358: Community Forums
359: Community Forums
360: Community Forums
361: Photo Gallery
362: Community Forums
363: Community Forums
364: Photo Gallery
365: Community Forums
366: Community Forums
367: Community Forums
368: Community Forums
369: Member Screenshots
370: Home
371: Community Forums
372: Member Screenshots
373: Downloads
374: Community Forums
375: Photo Gallery
376: Home
377: Home
378: Photo Gallery
379: Community Forums
380: Community Forums
381: Community Forums
382: Home
383: Community Forums
384: Community Forums
385: Downloads
386: Member Screenshots
387: Community Forums
388: Downloads
389: Community Forums
390: Photo Gallery
391: Home
392: Home
393: Photo Gallery
394: Community Forums
395: Community Forums
396: Community Forums
397: Your Account
398: Community Forums
399: CPGlang
400: Community Forums
401: Home
402: Community Forums
403: Community Forums
404: Community Forums
405: Community Forums
406: Downloads
407: Home
408: Photo Gallery
409: Community Forums
410: Downloads
411: Photo Gallery
412: Community Forums
413: Community Forums
414: Community Forums
415: Community Forums
416: Community Forums
417: Photo Gallery
418: Community Forums
419: Downloads
420: Community Forums
421: Photo Gallery
422: Photo Gallery
423: Community Forums
424: Community Forums
425: Home
426: Your Account
427: Community Forums
428: Community Forums
429: Member Screenshots
430: Photo Gallery
431: Photo Gallery
432: Community Forums
433: Downloads
434: Community Forums
435: Community Forums
436: Home
437: Community Forums
438: Community Forums
439: Community Forums
440: Community Forums
441: Community Forums
442: Community Forums
443: Member Screenshots
444: Your Account
445: Community Forums
446: Home
447: Photo Gallery
448: Community Forums
449: Downloads
450: Community Forums
451: Community Forums
452: Community Forums
453: Community Forums
454: Photo Gallery
455: Community Forums
456: Community Forums
457: Community Forums
458: Community Forums
459: Community Forums
460: Downloads
461: Photo Gallery
462: Community Forums
463: Community Forums
464: Community Forums
465: Community Forums
466: Community Forums
467: Community Forums
468: Community Forums
469: Downloads
470: Community Forums
471: Community Forums
472: Community Forums
473: Home
474: Community Forums
475: Community Forums
476: Community Forums
477: Community Forums
478: Community Forums
479: Community Forums
480: Community Forums
481: Community Forums
482: Community Forums
483: Community Forums
484: Community Forums
485: Statistics
486: Community Forums
487: Community Forums
488: Photo Gallery
489: Community Forums
490: Member Screenshots
491: Community Forums
492: Community Forums
493: Photo Gallery
494: Community Forums
495: Community Forums
496: Photo Gallery
497: Home
498: Community Forums
499: CPGlang
500: Community Forums
501: Downloads
502: Community Forums
503: Photo Gallery
504: Photo Gallery
505: Community Forums
506: Photo Gallery
507: Home
508: Community Forums
509: Community Forums
510: Photo Gallery
511: Community Forums
512: Community Forums
513: Community Forums
514: Community Forums
515: Community Forums
516: Community Forums
517: Community Forums
518: Photo Gallery
519: Community Forums
520: Community Forums
521: Community Forums
522: Community Forums
523: Community Forums
524: Home
525: Community Forums
526: Photo Gallery
527: Photo Gallery
528: Community Forums
529: Community Forums
530: Community Forums
531: Photo Gallery
532: Community Forums
533: Community Forums
534: Community Forums
535: Home
536: Community Forums
537: Community Forums
538: Community Forums
539: Community Forums
540: Community Forums
541: Member Screenshots
542: Community Forums
543: Photo Gallery
544: Photo Gallery
545: Home
546: Community Forums
547: CPGlang
548: Member Screenshots
549: Community Forums
550: Community Forums
551: Community Forums
552: Photo Gallery
553: Photo Gallery
554: Photo Gallery
555: Home
556: Community Forums
557: Photo Gallery
558: Home
559: Community Forums
560: Community Forums
561: Community Forums
562: Home
563: Photo Gallery
564: Community Forums
565: Community Forums
566: Community Forums
567: Home
568: Community Forums
569: Community Forums
570: Community Forums
571: Home
572: Photo Gallery
573: Photo Gallery
574: Home
575: Photo Gallery
576: Community Forums
577: Community Forums
578: Community Forums
579: Community Forums
580: Your Account
581: Community Forums
582: Community Forums
583: Community Forums
584: Community Forums
585: Community Forums
586: Community Forums

Staff Online:

No staff members are online!
Latrun Armor Museum, Israel
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page     Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board

View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
armyjunk2
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Sep 22, 2006
Posts: 1416

PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2009 10:11 pm
Post subject: Re: Latrun Armor Museum, Israel

Thanks Trevor, More than sevearl of the signs are off.....
Back to top
View user's profile
Neil_Baumgardner
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 3942
Location: Arlington, VA
PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2009 2:36 am
Post subject: Re: Latrun Armor Museum, Israel

- TrevorLarkum
- Neil_Baumgardner
I want to say it had something to do with looking over the Suez Canal - I could be completely off, but I seem to remember something like that was used between '67 & '73...


Neil, are you thinking of this one?



Oh yeah, right, thats it...

Neil
Back to top
View user's profile
binder001
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 25, 2006
Posts: 363

PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2009 2:55 pm
Post subject: Re: Latrun Armor Museum, Israel

1) Very NICE photos - sharp and well exposed. The watermark can be a bit annoying to people like me who like to download the photos, but I certainly know why it's there.

2) Some comments;

your first M47 shot (the OD one) is an M47 that was rebuilt with 105mm gun and diesel engine. Italy, Iran, and ??? had these

the second M47 (the sand colored one) looks pretty original

the M32VVSS looks like an original M32 - it has the grouser compartment vents at the rear.

the M32HVSS is more correctly an M32A1B1 (A1 for the HVSS modification, B1 is for the M4A1 hull). Very much like the one at the Patton Museum

The first M3 shown is a Grant, the second is a "Lee". I couldn't see the engine deck to see if it's an M3A-whatever. Latrun has/had an M31 recovery vehicle in good shape, that would give Israel quite a collection of M3 medium variants.

Thanks again for sharing.

Gary
Back to top
View user's profile
armyjunk2
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Sep 22, 2006
Posts: 1416

PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2009 4:34 pm
Post subject: Re: Latrun Armor Museum, Israel

Gary Thank you for the info, all the "watermark" is about I appreciate people asking me first to use the pics. everyone is welcome to them without the marks. I'm trying to post some of the larger vehicles collections over on the CDSG site. We have the experts here and its not me, I appreciate the help from everyone here Please feel free to add anything.

again anyone want pics without "watermarks' just ask, we will figure out how to get them to you...
Back to top
View user's profile
Joe_D
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 29, 2006
Posts: 2066
Location: Razorback Country
PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2009 5:00 pm
Post subject: Re: Latrun Armor Museum, Israel

Fantastic series of pictures,

If I ever get a chance I will have to go there.

Few questions,

All that odd bridging equipment, are those left over from '73 from when the Egyptians breached the defenses?

Picture 133, Stared at it for quite some time. Looks like a Centurion Turret on a modified Cent chassis. Uses what appears to be the US AVDS-1790 series engine. I at first thought it might have been some pilot vehicle for the Merkava program but the structure behind the drivers hatch doesn't allow a gun to depress. I'm stumped, what is it????

Thanks for sharing AJ2,

_________________
Joe_D
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
armyjunk2
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Sep 22, 2006
Posts: 1416

PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2009 5:26 pm
Post subject: Re: Latrun Armor Museum, Israel

Joe, this will help Smile I will try to get another pic from my buddy

[pic deleted


Last edited by armyjunk2 on Fri May 29, 2009 2:15 am; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile
TrevorLarkum
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Sep 16, 2007
Posts: 1596
Location: Northampton, England
PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2009 7:59 pm
Post subject: Re: Latrun Armor Museum, Israel

- Joe_D
Picture 133, Stared at it for quite some time. Looks like a Centurion Turret on a modified Cent chassis. Uses what appears to be the US AVDS-1790 series engine. I at first thought it might have been some pilot vehicle for the Merkava program but the structure behind the drivers hatch doesn't allow a gun to depress. I'm stumped, what is it????


Joe, you're spot on. I researched Latrun and wrote up all the tanks there for a book on Preserved Tanks in the Middle East. If you guys are interested, I'll make it available for download. Anyway, to quote from it, entry #57:

"This is a prototype of the Merkava, with a new hull on a heavily modified Centurion chassis. It was constructed after the Six Day War, under the direction of General Tal. It had its engine at the front, by positioning the driver at the back and driving the vehicle in reverse. It is fitted with a Centurion turret, apparently from a Mark 3, that is without its gun and is stripped of most external fittings."

My understanding is that it was just a concept trial vehicle, i.e. to try out the feasibility of having the turret behind the engine.

_________________
Trevor

Dr Trevor Larkum
Preserved Tanks: PreservedTanks.com
Armour Archive: ArmourArchive.co.uk
EVs
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website
Joe_D
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 29, 2006
Posts: 2066
Location: Razorback Country
PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2009 8:39 pm
Post subject: Re: Latrun Armor Museum, Israel

Thanks Trevor,

Guess it was an automotive trails type vehicle then, with no need for a gun. Turret was most likely necessary for weight.

_________________
Joe_D
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Neil_Baumgardner
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 3942
Location: Arlington, VA
PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2009 11:24 pm
Post subject: Re: Latrun Armor Museum, Israel

I found #136 to be very interesting, if it is what I think it is...

Neil
Back to top
View user's profile
TrevorLarkum
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Sep 16, 2007
Posts: 1596
Location: Northampton, England
PostPosted: Sat May 16, 2009 1:39 pm
Post subject: Re: Latrun Armor Museum, Israel

I'm thinking you're thinking it's what was used to breach the Suez Canal?

_________________
Trevor

Dr Trevor Larkum
Preserved Tanks: PreservedTanks.com
Armour Archive: ArmourArchive.co.uk
EVs
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website
Buq-Buq
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 04, 2006
Posts: 86

PostPosted: Sat May 16, 2009 2:01 pm
Post subject: Re: Latrun Armor Museum, Israel

Yeah, I believe that #136 is the "Roller Bridge". This bridge that was designed prior to the 1973 war, and constructed in Sinai . . . vaguely along the route that would be tentatively used for a crossing of the Suez Canal. There was a prepared site, called "The Yard", just north of the Matzmed fortification (on the northern edge of the Great Bitter Lake, opposite Deversoir), where the ground and Suez Canal berm had been prepped for a major bridging operation. The 400 ton "Roller Bridge" was towed to the canal by a company of tanks. Some sources say that the towing unit was comprised of tanks that had been firepower-killed in battle, but seem to recall that I've recently read that this tank company was specially-designated and trained for the operation. As the bridge was being moved towards the canal, apparently it broke down, and the bridging operation was thrown into chaos (note that this is apart from the efforts of the Egyptian troops in the area!). For a while, the Israelis had to rely on the Gillois amphibians (#137) to ferry units across the canal.

I have often wondered how a bridge could 'break down', but seeing how this thing was constructed, it is easy to imagine now . . .




Mark
Back to top
View user's profile
Massimo_Foti
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Apr 08, 2008
Posts: 5397
Location: Lugano, Switzerland
PostPosted: Sat May 16, 2009 2:51 pm
Post subject: Re: Latrun Armor Museum, Israel

I am not 100%, but I don't remember italian M47s using a 105mm gun. Do you have any reference of this?
Back to top
View user's profile
RKlaus
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 28, 2006
Posts: 12

PostPosted: Sun May 17, 2009 3:43 am
Post subject: Re: Latrun Armor Museum, Israel

Armyjunk,
Thanks for posting these. Great pictures!
I'm particularly grateful for #009. I had not known that any of the upgraded White Scout Cars had survived.

Robert
Back to top
View user's profile
JG300-Ascout
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 05, 2005
Posts: 6257
Location: Cyberspace
PostPosted: Sun May 17, 2009 3:55 am
Post subject: Re: Latrun Armor Museum, Israel

I do wish they'd make some effort to push that Sheridan M81 gun back into battery. Just stick a hydraulic jack in there and pump away if that's what it takes.

Curious about the M47 with the 105mm gun also. I know the Israelis were masters of upgrades and upgunning. Never seen this one before.

_________________
"All facts go to clearly prove that Shades is a thrice-cursed traitor & mentally deranged person steeped in inveterate enmity toward mankind"
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Joe_D
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 29, 2006
Posts: 2066
Location: Razorback Country
PostPosted: Sun May 17, 2009 4:52 am
Post subject: Re: Latrun Armor Museum, Israel

That M47 105mm looks just like the BMY specials,

TACOM designed an upgrade kit for the M47 utilizing M60A1 components, much like the M48A3 program. Was for the export market. Called M47M. Bunch of them were converted for the Iranian Army. Pakistan also converted a bunch. Conversions were done in Iran for both. Gap between 5th and 6th road wheels was created so the AVDS-1790 oil pan would clear the torsion bars. Chrysler Espania also used the same kit for the Spanish Army, but I think they kept the 90mm.

Massimo,

I don't think the Italian Army converted any of theirs since they were replaced by M60's and Leo 1's IIRC. I do Know OTO Melera made a kit very similar if not the same as the BMY one and offered it for export.

This tank may be one given to Israel to demonstrate the kit. It doesn't look like Former Iranian or Pakistani.

_________________
Joe_D
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page    Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board
Page 2 of 3
All times are GMT - 6 Hours
Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next



Jump to:  


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum