±Recent Visitors

Recent Visitors to Com-Central!

±User Info-big


Welcome Anonymous

Nickname
Password

Membership:
Latest: Harold_Biondo
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Overall: 6644

People Online:
Members: 0
Visitors: 183
Total: 183
Who Is Where:
 Visitors:
01: Downloads
02: Your Account
03: Downloads
04: Community Forums
05: Home
06: Downloads
07: Community Forums
08: Downloads
09: Community Forums
10: Community Forums
11: Community Forums
12: Community Forums
13: Community Forums
14: CPGlang
15: Community Forums
16: Photo Gallery
17: Community Forums
18: Community Forums
19: Member Screenshots
20: Downloads
21: Community Forums
22: Community Forums
23: Home
24: Home
25: Community Forums
26: Community Forums
27: Community Forums
28: Photo Gallery
29: Community Forums
30: Community Forums
31: Home
32: Community Forums
33: Community Forums
34: Community Forums
35: Community Forums
36: CPGlang
37: Community Forums
38: Community Forums
39: Community Forums
40: Home
41: Photo Gallery
42: Community Forums
43: Statistics
44: Community Forums
45: Community Forums
46: Community Forums
47: Photo Gallery
48: Photo Gallery
49: Community Forums
50: Community Forums
51: Photo Gallery
52: Community Forums
53: Your Account
54: Community Forums
55: CPGlang
56: Downloads
57: Home
58: Home
59: Downloads
60: Community Forums
61: Community Forums
62: Home
63: Photo Gallery
64: Statistics
65: Community Forums
66: Community Forums
67: Community Forums
68: Downloads
69: Photo Gallery
70: Community Forums
71: Downloads
72: Community Forums
73: Community Forums
74: Community Forums
75: Downloads
76: Downloads
77: Community Forums
78: Community Forums
79: Community Forums
80: Downloads
81: Home
82: Home
83: CPGlang
84: Home
85: Community Forums
86: Downloads
87: Downloads
88: Community Forums
89: Home
90: Community Forums
91: Community Forums
92: Community Forums
93: Community Forums
94: Home
95: Downloads
96: CPGlang
97: Community Forums
98: Community Forums
99: Photo Gallery
100: CPGlang
101: Downloads
102: Photo Gallery
103: Community Forums
104: Community Forums
105: Downloads
106: Community Forums
107: Photo Gallery
108: Home
109: Community Forums
110: Photo Gallery
111: Home
112: Community Forums
113: Downloads
114: Home
115: Home
116: Community Forums
117: Community Forums
118: Community Forums
119: Photo Gallery
120: Community Forums
121: Community Forums
122: CPGlang
123: Community Forums
124: Community Forums
125: Photo Gallery
126: Home
127: Home
128: Downloads
129: Community Forums
130: Community Forums
131: Community Forums
132: Search
133: Photo Gallery
134: Community Forums
135: Community Forums
136: Community Forums
137: Home
138: Member Screenshots
139: Home
140: Community Forums
141: Downloads
142: Community Forums
143: Community Forums
144: Home
145: Community Forums
146: Member Screenshots
147: Home
148: Community Forums
149: Home
150: Downloads
151: CPGlang
152: Photo Gallery
153: Home
154: Photo Gallery
155: Community Forums
156: Community Forums
157: Downloads
158: Home
159: Downloads
160: Community Forums
161: Community Forums
162: Photo Gallery
163: Home
164: Downloads
165: Community Forums
166: Photo Gallery
167: Downloads
168: Community Forums
169: Photo Gallery
170: Home
171: Community Forums
172: Statistics
173: Home
174: CPGlang
175: Photo Gallery
176: Community Forums
177: Community Forums
178: Community Forums
179: Home
180: Member Screenshots
181: Community Forums
182: Member Screenshots
183: Community Forums

Staff Online:

No staff members are online!
Early WWII US amphibious tanks
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page     Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board

View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Maple_Leaf_Eh
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 517

PostPosted: Fri Jul 28, 2006 12:49 pm
Post subject: Early WWII US amphibious tanks

Several months ago I started reading "Panzer Operations, the Eastern Front Memoir of General (Erhard) Raus, 1941-1945", compiled by Steven Newton (2003).

He started WWI as a platoon leader, and ended as battalion commander. He stayed in the Austrian army between the wars, and eventually rose to be one of the most experienced German tank officers of WWII. The fact he was in almost constant contact from Barbarossa to the surrender in Berlin speaks to his adaptability and successes. He was extensively interviewed post-war, although reportedly he was poorly translated which confused some of his legacy.

The part I wanted to ask this forum was he mentions encountering up to 12 Russian-manned American-made amphibious tanks as his troops were 'bulling' their way forward paralleling the Baltic coast towards Leningrad on 12 July 1941. What could they have been?
Back to top
View user's profile
Roy_A_Lingle
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1997
Location: El Paso & Ft Bliss, Texas
PostPosted: Fri Jul 28, 2006 5:44 pm
Post subject: Re: Early WWII US amphibious tanks

Hi Maple! Hi Folks!

- Maple_Leaf_Eh

"Panzer Operations, the Eastern Front Memoir of General (Erhard) Raus, 1941-1945", compiled by Steven Newton (2003).

He was extensively interviewed post-war, although reportedly he was poorly translated which confused some of his legacy.

The part I wanted to ask this forum was he mentions encountering up to 12 Russian-manned American-made amphibious tanks as his troops were 'bulling' their way forward paralleling the Baltic coast towards Leningrad on 12 July 1941. What could they have been?


July 1941? American made amphibious tanks in July 1941? In Russia?

Could the Soviets have had some of Walter Christie's designs? Something like the type he tried to sell to the U.S.M.C in the mid 1920s. There is a photo in Kenneth W. Estes' book "Marines Under Armor". The second page of photos, which are between pages 106 and 107, has a photo of a Christie amphibious tank (really a tracked 75mm gun) making an admin landing on Culebra Island in 1924 (U.S. Naval Institute photo).

Maybe something new for the history books? Shocked
Sgt, Scouts out!

_________________
"You can never have too much reconnaissance."
General G.S. Patton Jr.
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Maple_Leaf_Eh
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 517

PostPosted: Fri Jul 28, 2006 10:15 pm
Post subject: Re: Early WWII US amphibious tanks

That is the only sort of thing that I could surmise. The well known M series tanks weren't amphibs, so the Christie series were the only obvious alternative.
Back to top
View user's profile
Cloudy
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 06, 2006
Posts: 75

PostPosted: Sat Jul 29, 2006 12:04 am
Post subject: Re: Early WWII US amphibious tanks

Perhaps he confused the T-37/38 light amphibious tanks with the American "Combat Car" or M2 series vehicles which they broadly resemble - although they would rather unlikely be sailing along the Baltic coast at any time...
Back to top
View user's profile
Neil_Baumgardner
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 3942
Location: Arlington, VA
PostPosted: Sat Jul 29, 2006 1:09 am
Post subject: Re: Early WWII US amphibious tanks

Perhaps PT-1A amphibious tanks, a variant of the Christie BT-series tanks?

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BT_tank

BTW, the account recounted above says they were encountered while paralleling the Baltic coast - not they they were necessarily IN the Baltic...


Neil
Back to top
View user's profile
Maple_Leaf_Eh
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 517

PostPosted: Sat Jul 29, 2006 2:01 am
Post subject: Re: Early WWII US amphibious tanks

p48 of above cited book, starting midparagraph, "The day long struggle against the swamp, caused by the accuracy of the available maps and the lack of engineer equipment prevented us from attacking near Novoselye on 11 July.

Next morning, our advance detachment attacked the flank of the Russian forces guarding the highway, whose presence south of a small swampy stream had been reported the day before. After a short sharp engagement, including a tank fight, we threw the flank guard back across the river. American amphibious tanks made their first appearance on the Russian front in this action. Six of them fell victim to our antitank and panzer fire at close range from a wooded area - three knocked out on land and three while crossing the small stream. The first German troops to gain the northern bank seized two of them that were still serviceable. [[Oops, I miscounted in my first posting saying there were at least 12.]]

The six foot deep stream was not fordable, so our engineers again had to construct a bridge for the Kampfgruppe's main body."

The map in the book shows this action to be in ESTONIA south of the LUGA RIVER, which is south of LENINGRAD, and between LAKE PEIPUS on the west and LAKE ILMEN on the east.

This battlegroup was panzer in only a small part. The majority of their some 60 tanks were Czech 38Ts with a few Pz IIs. Other parts of the division had similar lightweight vehicles except with a few Pz IIIs and a few IVs in the fourth tank company of the tank battalions.

Further to the post above, I poked around Wikipedia and found this reference, but it is definately a Russian amphibious scout tank, en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T-40 .
Back to top
View user's profile
Sabot
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 380
Location: Kentucky
PostPosted: Sat Jul 29, 2006 12:09 pm
Post subject: Re: Early WWII US amphibious tanks

Did the Soviets get any of the LVT variants through lend-lease? If so, perhaps it was one of those Amtracs like the Buffalo or Alligator.

_________________
RobG
Back to top
View user's profile AIM Address
Roy_A_Lingle
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1997
Location: El Paso & Ft Bliss, Texas
PostPosted: Sat Jul 29, 2006 4:51 pm
Post subject: Re: Early WWII US amphibious tanks

Hi Sobot! Hi Folks!

- Sabot

Did the Soviets get any of the LVT variants through lend-lease? If so, perhaps it was one of those Amtracs like the Buffalo or Alligator.


I would think the date, July 1941, would have been a bit to early for any of those AFVs to have been in Soviet hands.

Anyone know when lend-lease started flowing to the Soviets?

Anyone know when the first Buffalo or Alligator designs where completed.?
I check all my books all I found was 'most' were used in the PTO.

I think Neil maybe on to something with his post.
"Perhaps PT-1A amphibious tanks, a variant of the Christie BT-series tanks?"

It is my understanding that the German's consisted the BT-series fast tanks as "American" tanks.

Interesting. Confused
Sgt, Scouts Out!

_________________
"You can never have too much reconnaissance."
General G.S. Patton Jr.
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Cloudy
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 06, 2006
Posts: 75

PostPosted: Sun Jul 30, 2006 5:09 am
Post subject: Re: Early WWII US amphibious tanks

- Neil_Baumgardner

BTW, the account recounted above says they were encountered while paralleling the Baltic coast - not they they were necessarily IN the Baltic...
Neil

D'oh! Nothing like superficial reading...

Alan
Back to top
View user's profile
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page    Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board
Page 1 of 1
All times are GMT - 6 Hours



Jump to:  


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum