±Recent Visitors

Recent Visitors to Com-Central!

±User Info-big


Welcome Anonymous

Nickname
Password

Membership:
Latest: cgsimpson
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Overall: 6645

People Online:
Members: 0
Visitors: 566
Total: 566
Who Is Where:
 Visitors:
01: Community Forums
02: Community Forums
03: Community Forums
04: Home
05: Community Forums
06: Community Forums
07: Photo Gallery
08: Community Forums
09: Photo Gallery
10: Community Forums
11: Home
12: Home
13: Photo Gallery
14: Community Forums
15: Statistics
16: Downloads
17: Home
18: Community Forums
19: Community Forums
20: Community Forums
21: Community Forums
22: Community Forums
23: Community Forums
24: Community Forums
25: Photo Gallery
26: Community Forums
27: Home
28: Community Forums
29: Home
30: Community Forums
31: Community Forums
32: CPGlang
33: Community Forums
34: Community Forums
35: Community Forums
36: Community Forums
37: Community Forums
38: Community Forums
39: Photo Gallery
40: Member Screenshots
41: Community Forums
42: Downloads
43: Photo Gallery
44: Community Forums
45: CPGlang
46: Community Forums
47: Community Forums
48: Community Forums
49: CPGlang
50: Community Forums
51: Community Forums
52: Home
53: Community Forums
54: Community Forums
55: Community Forums
56: Photo Gallery
57: Photo Gallery
58: Community Forums
59: Photo Gallery
60: Photo Gallery
61: Home
62: Your Account
63: Community Forums
64: Community Forums
65: Community Forums
66: Photo Gallery
67: Photo Gallery
68: News Archive
69: Community Forums
70: Community Forums
71: Community Forums
72: Community Forums
73: Community Forums
74: Community Forums
75: Community Forums
76: Community Forums
77: Photo Gallery
78: Photo Gallery
79: Community Forums
80: Member Screenshots
81: Community Forums
82: Photo Gallery
83: Community Forums
84: Downloads
85: Photo Gallery
86: Home
87: Photo Gallery
88: Community Forums
89: Community Forums
90: Community Forums
91: Community Forums
92: Community Forums
93: Community Forums
94: Community Forums
95: Community Forums
96: Downloads
97: Member Screenshots
98: Photo Gallery
99: Community Forums
100: Your Account
101: Community Forums
102: Community Forums
103: Community Forums
104: Community Forums
105: Photo Gallery
106: Community Forums
107: Community Forums
108: Community Forums
109: Community Forums
110: Community Forums
111: Community Forums
112: Community Forums
113: Community Forums
114: Community Forums
115: Community Forums
116: Community Forums
117: Home
118: Community Forums
119: News Archive
120: Community Forums
121: Community Forums
122: Community Forums
123: Member Screenshots
124: Community Forums
125: Community Forums
126: Community Forums
127: Community Forums
128: Community Forums
129: Community Forums
130: Downloads
131: Community Forums
132: Community Forums
133: Community Forums
134: Community Forums
135: Community Forums
136: Community Forums
137: Community Forums
138: Community Forums
139: Community Forums
140: Home
141: Community Forums
142: Community Forums
143: Downloads
144: Community Forums
145: Member Screenshots
146: Community Forums
147: Community Forums
148: Community Forums
149: Member Screenshots
150: Community Forums
151: Photo Gallery
152: Community Forums
153: Community Forums
154: Community Forums
155: Community Forums
156: Community Forums
157: Community Forums
158: Community Forums
159: Community Forums
160: Community Forums
161: Photo Gallery
162: Home
163: Photo Gallery
164: Downloads
165: Community Forums
166: Downloads
167: Member Screenshots
168: Community Forums
169: Community Forums
170: Community Forums
171: Community Forums
172: Community Forums
173: Community Forums
174: Community Forums
175: Community Forums
176: Community Forums
177: Home
178: Photo Gallery
179: Community Forums
180: Community Forums
181: Community Forums
182: Photo Gallery
183: Photo Gallery
184: Community Forums
185: Community Forums
186: Community Forums
187: Community Forums
188: Community Forums
189: Community Forums
190: Community Forums
191: Community Forums
192: Community Forums
193: Community Forums
194: Community Forums
195: Downloads
196: Photo Gallery
197: Home
198: Community Forums
199: Community Forums
200: Home
201: Photo Gallery
202: Community Forums
203: Photo Gallery
204: Community Forums
205: Community Forums
206: Community Forums
207: Photo Gallery
208: Home
209: Home
210: News Archive
211: Photo Gallery
212: Community Forums
213: Community Forums
214: Photo Gallery
215: Photo Gallery
216: Your Account
217: Community Forums
218: Your Account
219: Home
220: Community Forums
221: Your Account
222: Photo Gallery
223: Community Forums
224: Downloads
225: Photo Gallery
226: Community Forums
227: Community Forums
228: Community Forums
229: Community Forums
230: Community Forums
231: Photo Gallery
232: Community Forums
233: Community Forums
234: Community Forums
235: Community Forums
236: Photo Gallery
237: News
238: Photo Gallery
239: Community Forums
240: Photo Gallery
241: Photo Gallery
242: Photo Gallery
243: Community Forums
244: Downloads
245: Community Forums
246: Photo Gallery
247: Downloads
248: Community Forums
249: Photo Gallery
250: Photo Gallery
251: Community Forums
252: Photo Gallery
253: Community Forums
254: Community Forums
255: Community Forums
256: Community Forums
257: Community Forums
258: Home
259: Home
260: Community Forums
261: Community Forums
262: Community Forums
263: Photo Gallery
264: Downloads
265: Community Forums
266: Community Forums
267: Community Forums
268: Photo Gallery
269: Photo Gallery
270: Community Forums
271: Community Forums
272: CPGlang
273: Photo Gallery
274: Community Forums
275: Home
276: Community Forums
277: Community Forums
278: Home
279: Community Forums
280: Community Forums
281: Community Forums
282: Community Forums
283: Community Forums
284: News
285: Home
286: Community Forums
287: Downloads
288: Community Forums
289: Photo Gallery
290: Community Forums
291: Community Forums
292: Photo Gallery
293: Photo Gallery
294: Photo Gallery
295: Community Forums
296: Photo Gallery
297: Community Forums
298: Community Forums
299: Community Forums
300: Home
301: Community Forums
302: Community Forums
303: Home
304: Community Forums
305: Downloads
306: Community Forums
307: Community Forums
308: Photo Gallery
309: Photo Gallery
310: Home
311: Photo Gallery
312: Home
313: News Archive
314: Community Forums
315: Community Forums
316: CPGlang
317: Community Forums
318: Community Forums
319: Community Forums
320: Community Forums
321: Community Forums
322: Community Forums
323: Photo Gallery
324: Community Forums
325: Community Forums
326: Community Forums
327: Community Forums
328: Community Forums
329: Community Forums
330: Home
331: Community Forums
332: Your Account
333: Photo Gallery
334: Downloads
335: Community Forums
336: Community Forums
337: Community Forums
338: Home
339: Your Account
340: CPGlang
341: Community Forums
342: Photo Gallery
343: Photo Gallery
344: Photo Gallery
345: Home
346: Photo Gallery
347: Community Forums
348: Community Forums
349: Photo Gallery
350: Community Forums
351: Community Forums
352: Community Forums
353: Home
354: Community Forums
355: Community Forums
356: Community Forums
357: Community Forums
358: Community Forums
359: Community Forums
360: Community Forums
361: Community Forums
362: Photo Gallery
363: Community Forums
364: Community Forums
365: Community Forums
366: Community Forums
367: Community Forums
368: Community Forums
369: Home
370: Community Forums
371: Home
372: Photo Gallery
373: Community Forums
374: Community Forums
375: Community Forums
376: Community Forums
377: Home
378: Community Forums
379: Community Forums
380: Home
381: Community Forums
382: Your Account
383: Community Forums
384: Community Forums
385: Home
386: Member Screenshots
387: Photo Gallery
388: Community Forums
389: Home
390: Community Forums
391: Your Account
392: Community Forums
393: Home
394: Community Forums
395: Community Forums
396: Community Forums
397: Member Screenshots
398: Community Forums
399: Community Forums
400: Community Forums
401: CPGlang
402: Community Forums
403: Community Forums
404: Community Forums
405: Community Forums
406: Photo Gallery
407: Community Forums
408: Community Forums
409: Community Forums
410: Photo Gallery
411: Statistics
412: Community Forums
413: Community Forums
414: Downloads
415: Photo Gallery
416: Downloads
417: Community Forums
418: Community Forums
419: Community Forums
420: Community Forums
421: Downloads
422: Community Forums
423: News
424: Community Forums
425: Photo Gallery
426: Community Forums
427: News Archive
428: Community Forums
429: Community Forums
430: Photo Gallery
431: Community Forums
432: Photo Gallery
433: Community Forums
434: Community Forums
435: Photo Gallery
436: Photo Gallery
437: Community Forums
438: Home
439: Community Forums
440: Downloads
441: Statistics
442: Community Forums
443: Home
444: Community Forums
445: Community Forums
446: Community Forums
447: Community Forums
448: Community Forums
449: Community Forums
450: Community Forums
451: Downloads
452: Member Screenshots
453: Community Forums
454: CPGlang
455: Downloads
456: Your Account
457: Community Forums
458: Community Forums
459: Photo Gallery
460: Community Forums
461: Community Forums
462: Community Forums
463: Home
464: Community Forums
465: Community Forums
466: Downloads
467: Community Forums
468: Community Forums
469: Community Forums
470: Community Forums
471: Photo Gallery
472: News
473: Community Forums
474: Downloads
475: Community Forums
476: Community Forums
477: Community Forums
478: Community Forums
479: Home
480: Community Forums
481: Community Forums
482: Community Forums
483: Community Forums
484: Community Forums
485: Community Forums
486: Community Forums
487: Community Forums
488: Community Forums
489: Community Forums
490: Community Forums
491: Community Forums
492: Community Forums
493: Community Forums
494: Photo Gallery
495: Community Forums
496: Photo Gallery
497: News
498: Photo Gallery
499: Community Forums
500: Community Forums
501: Community Forums
502: Home
503: Community Forums
504: Downloads
505: Community Forums
506: Community Forums
507: Photo Gallery
508: Photo Gallery
509: Your Account
510: Photo Gallery
511: Community Forums
512: Community Forums
513: Community Forums
514: Community Forums
515: Community Forums
516: Home
517: Home
518: Community Forums
519: Photo Gallery
520: Community Forums
521: Downloads
522: Community Forums
523: Community Forums
524: CPGlang
525: Community Forums
526: Community Forums
527: Photo Gallery
528: Downloads
529: Photo Gallery
530: Community Forums
531: Home
532: Community Forums
533: Community Forums
534: Community Forums
535: Photo Gallery
536: Community Forums
537: Community Forums
538: Downloads
539: Community Forums
540: Community Forums
541: Community Forums
542: Community Forums
543: Community Forums
544: Photo Gallery
545: Community Forums
546: Community Forums
547: Community Forums
548: Photo Gallery
549: Community Forums
550: Home
551: Community Forums
552: Community Forums
553: Community Forums
554: Community Forums
555: Photo Gallery
556: Community Forums
557: Community Forums
558: Community Forums
559: Home
560: Community Forums
561: Downloads
562: Downloads
563: Community Forums
564: Photo Gallery
565: Community Forums
566: Photo Gallery

Staff Online:

No staff members are online!
M103 Tank Ammo (120mm)
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
Go to page Previous  1, 2
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page     Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board

View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Jinx
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 186
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Wed Mar 15, 2006 2:42 am
Post subject: Re: M103 Tank Ammo (120mm)

- Dontos
Mike

120mm HEAT(M830:HEAT-MP-T) 53.4 lbs
120mm SABOT(M829A1: APFSDS-T) 46.22 lbs

As referenced from 'M1 Abrams at War' by Michael Green



Thank you kindly. They both use a combustible cartridge case, don't they? And the same for any other round - including training - fired from this gun?
Back to top
View user's profile
oldtop
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 17, 2006
Posts: 70

PostPosted: Sat Mar 18, 2006 6:21 pm
Post subject: Re: M103 Tank Ammo (120mm)

OK..for you non-Marine tankers, the M103 had two loaders, one (number one loader) grabed the projo, the other (number two loader ..that was me most of the time!!)) held the case and removed the bakelite cover, no.1 loaded the projo in the case mouth, No 2 loader then rammed the 65lbs case/charge and 51 lbs AP projo home, the No 2 lolader had to watch for "air bounce" which was when the case came lose from the projo (a bad thing in combat) the crew then broke out the ram staft and "Bell rammer head" while the case was remove and the projo was jammed lose form the gun tube throat and caught before it hit the deck (another bad thing in combat)
.......The M58 120mm gun AP round (APBC-T M358) would punch a hole through 221 mm of armor plate @ 30deg. at a range of 1,000 yds. or 196mm at 2,000 yds, when everything worked right this tank was at the time the "Queen of the battle field" however she never fired a shot in anger so we'll never know!
.......Yes the FV200 or Conqueror used the same main gun, the conqueror used a mechanical spent case ejector.
You'll find one of each (M103A2 and Conqueror) sitting in the Littlefield museum, the M103 is suffering from the most common of it's ailments for this vehicle, bad seals in the elevation cylinder and is being held in postion by a 4x4 between the turret roof and the gun breech. Surprised
Back to top
View user's profile
oldtop
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 17, 2006
Posts: 70

PostPosted: Sun Mar 19, 2006 8:24 pm
Post subject: Re: M103 Tank Ammo (120mm)


This the only picture I've seen showing a assembled 120mm round, and nope it's not me.
Back to top
View user's profile
mike_Duplessis
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 236

PostPosted: Mon Mar 20, 2006 2:08 pm
Post subject: Re: M103 Tank Ammo (120mm)

Poor old M103 was the victim of technology. I believe the long tube 90mm gun on the T-95 MBT prototype fired what may have been the first proper APFSDS round. A 40mm diameter subcaliber dart that outperformed the M103's massive 50 pound shot. That was followed by the 40mm diameter steel dart fired from the Russian T-62's 115mm gun, which also outperformed the big gun. Though the 120mm rifled gun was exponentially more accurate at long range than the darts the writing was on the wall for the M103.
Back to top
View user's profile
oldtop
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 17, 2006
Posts: 70

PostPosted: Mon Mar 20, 2006 7:15 pm
Post subject: Re: M103 Tank Ammo (120mm)

The M103 was a victim of the U.S. Army lackof being farsighted and DOD being cheap, what could they have done with the M103 as a starting point, the Brits solved the over sized shells problems for their 120mm tank guns, GD had a 1,000 + hp diesel engine and the transmission had been developed and was in production (XT 1400)..what could have been if the Army would have stopped crapping a round with the always under gunned M60...ya, ya I know someone is going to bring up the M60 armed with the 152mm..you remember them and!!! poof they were gone. The T95, the prototype tank that was fitted with just about every main gun armerment under development and never made it to production.
M1A1 120mm gun, 67 tons.
M103 120mm gun, 62.5 tons
Back to top
View user's profile
mike_Duplessis
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 236

PostPosted: Mon Mar 20, 2006 9:10 pm
Post subject: Re: M103 Tank Ammo (120mm)

"...and never made it to production."

I've often thought the Sheridan's running gear looked suspiciously T-95-like. And The wedge-shape M60A1 turret was a continuation of one of the T-95 turret designs. And Russian espionage probably took T-95's 90mm smooth bore gun technology for their 115mm smooth bore. And Russian T64 composite armor probably benefitted from T-95 composite armor studies. It looks like a good percentage of T-95 survived after all!

M103 was such a monster because it needed to be big to carry around that big gun. The gun needed to be that big in order to K.O. the IS-3 with that whopping big AP shell. Once they found out how to kill the IS-3 with missiles and subcaliber hypervelicity AP rounds the big AP shell - and the big gun - and the monster tank that carried it became redundant. The big gun heavy tank (M1A2) was resurrected only after new armor techologies had made missiles and smaller-caliber hypervelicty rounds an iffy proposition. How the world turns.
Back to top
View user's profile
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page    Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board
Page 2 of 2
All times are GMT - 6 Hours
Go to page Previous  1, 2



Jump to:  


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum