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AFVID
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
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Jinx
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Posts: 186
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Mon Apr 24, 2006 7:45 pm
Post subject: Re: AFVID

- Roy_A_Lingle
Hi Jinx! Hi Folks!

- Jinx
- Roy_A_Lingle
Next five tanks, the 'V' shaped splash board would make them T-72s, Iraqi, 120mm


Not meaning to doubt the Scout.....but the reason i didn't say "T-72" was because i thought the turrets were too tall. I had only seen the "V-thingy" on T-64s, T-72s, T-80s and T-90s.....but i thought maybe they were retrofitted to the older tank.....?


Point number one! I could be very wrong about those tanks being T-72s!

This is how I figure they are T-72s.

Lead APC has Iraqi markings, therefore tanks following should also be Iraqi.
T-64, only used by Soviet Forces in East Germany, never exported.
T-80, I maybe wrong, don't think any of those were sold to Iraq.
T-90, Again I maybe wrong, but I am SURE that those have not yet been sold to anyone outside Russia.

It's a S-2/G-2 call, base on above intell, those tanks must be T-72s.
In light of addational intell (facts) my spot report can be updated.

Just check out my responce to Bob's question about photo number four.
I wasn't even talking about that photo, I missed the "left turn at Albququerque" and got lost.

Follow up edit:
Found the following intell estimate on Iraq tanks prior to the start of OIF:
Type 69 II....2,000
T-62.............1,500
T-72 M1...........700
M-77(T-55).........60

So those vehicles with the 'V' should be Iraqi T-72M1s unless someone knows the M-77 version of the T-55 had that item added.

Spot report update x 2.
Sgt, Scouts Out! Smile



I now believe they are, indeed, T-72s. Your observational and deductive skills are greatly superior to mine.

And.....having taken a closer look at that photo, i observed that the driver's position of these tanks is in the centre of the hull, and not on the left side (right side when looking at it from the front) as in the T-62. That should have been the giveaway for me.

I have since looked at several photos of T-72s, and indeed the turret looks just like the ones in the photo when viewed from that angle.

So a lesson has been learned from this exercise.

And that lesson was : look at the picture carefully before jumping to conclusions.

I shall do my best to remember that in future.

(I don't think anyone is going to hire me as a scout quite yet, though.....)
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Roy_A_Lingle
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Location: El Paso & Ft Bliss, Texas
PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2006 9:30 am
Post subject: Re: AFVID

Hi Folks!

Sense I don't think anyone has tried to ID the lead vehicle in photo number 8 (the one with the T-72 M1s in it), figured I would give it a try.

Ran acrossed this info while surfing the www looking for something else.

The lead vehicle is a YW750 Ambulance. Shocked

Lead vehicle is an ambulance? Surprised

Spot Report!
Sgt, Scouts Out! Smile

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Dontos
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Location: Vine Grove, KY
PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2006 11:29 am
Post subject: Re: AFVID

Roy

That is correct....But... can you ID the last two vehicles, in the convoy...??

Don

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"Gonna hold my breath until Armor returns home..."
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Roy_A_Lingle
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Posts: 1997
Location: El Paso & Ft Bliss, Texas
PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2006 1:09 pm
Post subject: Re: AFVID

Hi Dontos! Hi Folks!

- Dontos
Roy
That is correct....But... can you ID the last two vehicles, in the convoy...??


One looks like it might be a BMP. Shocked

The one behind it, no idea, but it does reminds me of a M113 with the engine hatch open. Confused

Half confuzed!

Sgt, Scouts Out! Smile

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General G.S. Patton Jr.
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Sabot
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Location: Kentucky
PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2006 4:26 pm
Post subject: Re: AFVID

The next to the last vehicle in photo #8 looks like an MT-LB. I can't see the final vehicle well enough to even hazard a guess.

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palic
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Posts: 172

PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2006 7:56 pm
Post subject: Re: AFVID

Last vehicle in the convoy seems to be something similar to M-113 or FV-432...
In front of that (let us say a mysterious) vehicle there is definitely BMP-2 (two open hatches on the turret, 30 mm automatic chain gun)... In front of that BMP-2 there seems to be a turretless BMP chassis (may it be a wreck without a blown-off turret or a turretless ARV variant)...
I would say this is a wreck without a turret - the hull seems to be down on the ground when compared to BMP-2 next to that...

To Sabot: Can you recognize "reversed drop shaped" (this does not sound like English..) light guard frames on the turretless "wreck" - it is a typical feature for BMP-1 and 2 vehicles...

Please find detail of picture attached below...
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Dontos
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2006 9:17 pm
Post subject: Re: AFVID

In that photo is

1-YW750
7 -T 72's
1-turretless BMP
1-BMP2
1-MTLB
1-M113

I'm looking for the individual vehicles photos, if anyone is interested.

Don
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Rikard_Hufschmied
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Posts: 458
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
PostPosted: Wed Apr 26, 2006 9:51 am
Post subject: Re: AFVID

- Dontos
Damn, they actually built that thing...!?

Actually I believe the drawing may have been a concept drawing.

It sure looks like dual - mini Marders,....

Thanks Bug'

Don


You're not that far off, the concept of a turretless gun was first tested on a Marder hull:



It then evolved to a modified BV206 (Marder behind it):



It then matured to the prototype:





The project was cancelled mainly due to extensive costs (20-40% more exepensive than a conventional tank) and the prototype was not completed. As preserved at the Armor Museum in Axvall, Sweden the gun is a mock-up and it's also missing other parts.
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Sabot
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Posts: 380
Location: Kentucky
PostPosted: Wed Apr 26, 2006 11:31 am
Post subject: Re: AFVID

Wow, I actually got the MT-LB right, I didn't think it was a BMP. The open hatches didn't look right.

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Rikard_Hufschmied
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Posts: 458
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
PostPosted: Wed Apr 26, 2006 1:48 pm
Post subject: Re: AFVID

- Dontos
In that photo is

1-YW750
7 -T 72's
1-turretless BMP
1-BMP2
1-MTLB
1-M113

I'm looking for the individual vehicles photos, if anyone is interested.

Don


Hmm ... IMO the lead tank is a Type 69, for one thing the T 72 gunners rangefinder is missing on the left of the turret and the overall profile doesn't fit either. The others look like T-72s though.
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